Talk:Murad I
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[edit] Comments
[edit] my my, why Thai?
Why does there appear to be a Thai-alphabet caption under the photo?? AnonMoos 16:30, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
- I removed it. Even if it was "Murad I" in Thai (which I don't know), it is out of context to put Thai in an article about an Ottoman sultan (just like any other to the Ottomans unrelated language would be). It was added by an anon here. /The Phoenix 14:51, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Offers
- In my opinion, we should add a section about Savcı Bey( Savcı Bey was the son and the heir of Murad I. but he betrayed his father).
- His son, Yakup, was murdered because they thought that he would want to be the new ruler. This happened just after the death of Murad I.
I want to add these details without giving any damage to this well organized article.Deliogul 15:49, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Second Picture
The miniature picture, why is it there? It was made in the 20th century, and looks nothing like him. Let's scrap it.24.36.198.179 22:35, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] the name "murad"
Okay, this maybe quite random, but the outcome could be interesting. I'm really curious about the name "Murad". The name, apparently comes from Arabic, in which the word means wish, goal, aim, etc. However the name does not have any religious or aristocratic connotations. To tell the truth, there is no ruler before Murad I that was given this name. So the name - since its in Arabic - is not Turkic, but it had not been widespread among the Muslim culture either. It seems quite peculiar to name a ruler a name that has no royal, religious, or whatsoever context. Also, the name "Murad" appears before Murad I, only as a name for an insignificant tribe in Arabic peninsula during Mohammed's reign. Am I being too curious here? Anyway, I just wanted to ask you people whether you know/guess anything about this? If we found something, it could be interesting to add it to the article. --Quinlan Vos (talk) 18:55, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Murad and Poisoned Knive
Povijest Bosne - Account of Bosnia
By Salih Sidki Hadzihuseinovic
A Bosnian living in the Ottoman Empire around 1878
Poglavlje 1: Od prahistorije do gubitka bosanske srednjovjekovne drzavnosti
Chapter 1: From prehistory till the loss of medieval Bosnian independence
..... (Skipping many pages till the end of this chapter)
"... Because he had offered to, as a scout, take the imperial army... ... the Sultan in the year 789 (1387/1388 A.D.) sent an aid with 20,000 soldiers toward Bosnia, along with the above-mentioned Lala Shahin-Pasha. Because he listened to the aid's suggestions, Lala Shahin-Pasha ended up entering the Bosnian lands. In the beginning, since there was no one there to stand up against him, he sent the bulk of his army to loot the countryside, while he stayed in one place with around 1000 soldiers. However, the aid secretely told the Bosnian King Tvrtko, that Shahin-Pasha's army was spread out, and that he was left with only a tiny bit of an undisciplined army to guard him.
Hearing this, King Tvrtko struck Shahin-Pasha's army with his armies and those of his nobles, numbering around 30,000. Because the Ottoman army was spread out, wasn't able to come and help Shahin-Pasha, the above mentioned king ordered his army to attack any faction of the Ottoman army they met. Shortly, Shahin Pasha found himself to have stirred 100 troubles. Even if he had 20,000 Ottoman soldiers, 15,000 of them had been slaughtered, and the other 5000 had escaped only with many difficulties.
When the Sultan heard these painful news, that they had dealt Shahin Pasha a loss which the Ottoman army had till then never gone through... ... ...the sultan was enraged and thought of revenge never gave him peace. He sent out letters to all his allies, including all Christian leaders who had earlier come under his protection and recognized his rule, calling them to come together at the field near Jenishehir (Larisa in Greece).
... ... However based on the defeat of Shahin-Pasha's ranks, the Christian kingdoms concluded that the allmighty Sultanate was weakened... ... and let the Sultan know that they had no intention to help him. And while the Sultan tried to get the above-mentioned to agree, some Christian leaders were planning to attack the Ottoman army and to destroy it... ... ...
The Serbian king Lazar had made an agreement with the kings of Hungary, Poland, Bohemia, Bosnia, Croatia, and some other Croatian nobels, and that is what set up the battle of Kosovo field.
That's how the Tzar Lazar brought together a large Crusader army and sent hem against the Ottoman Empire. Sultan Murat then, with what army he had, clashed with the infidels at Kosovo field, and after a vicious battle beat the enemy. In this battle, the above-mentioned Tzar Lazar lost his life. The bulk of the Islamic army went on to kill the retreating enemy.
The allmighty Sultan had been so happy that he himself went out onto the field, and looked around and went through the fallen bodies. However, among those bodies was injured infidel, son in law of the mentioned Lazar, Milosh Obilic. When the Sultan found him, he got up and claimed that he wanted to accept his rule. Saying he wanted to kiss his hand, he went onward towards the Sultan. Even though the Sultan's advisors tried to prevent this, he was eventually allowed. So he came close to the Sultan and with a tiny poisoned knife which he had hidden in his hand, stabbed him in the stomach, killing him. The killer was killed right then and there.
This battle occured on Monday, 15th Shabana, in the year 791 (15th VI, 1389/1390 Islamic country) and is among the most important battles of the Ottoman empire. With that battle, the Serbian kingdom was destroyed, and so was their honor and pride, and that is for them a big misfortune and shame. When they talk of it, they talk about it regretfully, for in that battel had died the Serbian King Lazar, his 'tast' Jug Bogdan and 9 of his 'Shura', and Milos Obilic, son in law of Lazar, and Ivan Kosancic, and Milan, warlord of Toplica, and Stefan Music, allfell, and most of the remaining army was murdered. Of those who had stayed behind their swords, not one was capable of being a warlord.
Yet when the Christians account of this battle, they talk not of their cowardness and weakness. The Christian army had, in this battle, numbered around 100,000 people they say. Meanwhile, they also write that the Islamic Sultan sent against them a force three times that size, numbering around 300,000, along with the 'fact' that their first and most important commander of the Christian army, son-in-law of Lazar, Vuk Brankovic, betrayed them and crossed over to the side of the Sultan, so that only because of his traitoring had it come to their defeat.
In fact the Christian army had more than 200,000 knights, and the Islamic army, in comparasment, was very small. When the commanders of the infidel army saw the weak numbers of the Ottomans, they were greatly excited that they were to, undoubtedly, get a victory on their behalf. Among them, especially excited was the nephew of King Lazar, saying that he would defeat the Ottomans with just his brigade.
Some recommended to attack the Ottomans in the middle of the night, saying "Let's send them in a retreat, why allow them to escape our swords?". "Tomorrow by dawn, through an attack on the field, we will liquidate this army" said others, so the night attack was given up.
According to the writing of the Christians, thier army, compared to the Ottomans, had been miniscule... ... ...why tehn, seeing the might of the Ottoman army, had they not run instead of throwing themselves into a death-trap?... ... ... From what can be understood, both sides fought truthfully, but through the help of the allmighty, turthfull (god/allah) a winning wind was blwoing from the Islamic side and they, through god's help won."
There. That's the basic Ottoman account of it. From there, the book goes on to tell how medieval Bosnia was conquered by the Ottomans, and the rest of the Balkans overrun in the following years.
- Note the above has been written by a muslim, who was/is definitely on ottoman side, calling lazar infidel, so even ottomans admit to that, lazar was already dying. There are other sources of course.
