Talk:Metrication in the United Kingdom

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From the perspective of the European continent, the UK and its old-fashioned system of measurement from the time of the ancien régime appears now like a funny exotic village of Asterix inside the European Union. The recent statements of Mr Verheugen on that matter are simply amazing and show the complaisance for ultra-nationalistic British lobbies in Brussels. But here only a small questions to the Britons who read this page: is metrication better accepted in parts of the country like Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland (the Republic of Ireland has indeed got totally rid of the "Imperial" (!) system)? --Hubertgui 10:34, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

I think most people only care about the pint, and only because beer/cider is traditionally sold in pints. The media is responsible for most of the anti-metric sentiment, presenting it as a loss of tradition and an imposition from the EU. Most young (<30) can use the SI system, and wouldn't have any difficulty following a recipe given in metric (though imperial measurements are usually given afterwards in British books). I don't think Scotland/Wales are any different, but I don't know for sure.

This page only provides aruments for metrification in the UK, it devotes insufficient space to the arguments against. They are a sentence or two at most

Please feel free to add them, although please be careful to cite sources when you do, especially as this could be a controversial issue! The POV tag is generally added only if there is substantial disagreement between people who can't agree - you might want to consider taking it down when you've made a change, since I don't think there is any conflict at this stage. Trollderella 02:49, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

I don't see any arguments for metrication, only a description of the status quo. If nobody can say what's wrong with the article then I'm going to remove the tag, as it's not helping. --Heron 10:21, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

I must add (totally my POV) that some of the "arguments against" are downright hilarious. A kilo too heavy for a housewife to carry? Did new mothers in the 1960s require pulleys and levers or some other mechanism to lift their newborns? 222.155.212.98 21:32, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Contents 1 Unsupported addtions to the list of legal exemptions 2 Metrication in the UK more likely than in the US? 3 Pint 4 Article cleanup 5 Telegraph 6 Fair use rationale for Image:Metrication-uk-logo.gif 7 Fair use rationale for Image:MetricbritainLogo.gif 8 Metrication a condition of accession? Unlikely!

[edit] Unsupported addtions to the list of legal exemptions

The list of legal exemptions includes references to the text of UK law. I have deleted mention of aircraft parking bays and ammunitiion calibre because these are not mentioned in the legal text. Bobblewik 18:05, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

Oops - I did not notice that the list was legal exemtions - the fact is that the UK military still uses fractions of an inch to measure amunition caliber - where should that fact go? Thanks! Trollderella 18:08, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

I am not sure where it should go. There is a lot of colloquial and legacy stuff around. Some people misunderstand that metrication can mean merely changing a label on existing non-metric products or it could mean new designs being fully hard metric. Perhaps there already is a section on that. If not, perhaps there should be. Keep up the good work. Bobblewik 18:13, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

Hi again Trollderella. You added the text The UK military continues to use fractions of an inch to measure amunition caliber.. I searched the British Army website (http://www.army.mod.uk/) and it looked to me like they use mm by default. I could only find one instance of fractions of an inch. That was for a heavy machine gun with calibre described as .5 inch or described as 12.7 mm.

Which weapons were you referring to? Bobblewik 22:54, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

It looks like you are right - they are describing .5 inch as 12.7mm, I am speaking primarily of spoken usage, which may lag, for example, the 50cal you talk about is imperial, but they are now 'officially' 12.7mm, while 51mm mortars are nominally 51.25mm, they are reffered to as 2inch mortars (which, indeed, they are). The same is true of 81mm mortars, and what is called on their web page a 7.62mm general purpose machine gun is clearly a .3cal, while the .2cal machine gun is now a 5.56mm. Trollderella 18:12, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

In common usage among soldiers I have never heard of a "2inch" morter, all calibres are quoted in mm. Perhaps its different amongst the older guys though..but i've never come across it. Bensonby 16:12, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Metrication in the UK more likely than in the US?

Unlike in the US, it seems that more daily things in the UK are metricated. Does full use of the Metric System seem inevitable to you British?

not really in the forseeable future,as culturally it is so entrenched. Even though children are taught in metric in schools their parents generation (including the school teachers)still ostensably think in imperial, thus bring their children up to think that way. Most people still measure their height in feet, distance in miles and of course, drink pints of beer....metrication only really seems to have taken hold in official documents and correspondence etc. when people often need a conversion into metric! Perhaps in the long run it will take hold through the efforts of government. Who knows? Bensonby 16:10, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

Complete metrication does seem inevitable in the UK to my generation. I'm 18 years old and whilst most people my age measure their height in feet and inches they would always give short distances and measurements in either metres or centimetres. The same goes for weight, while most weigh themselves in stone very few people my age understand pounds and ounces and would always weigh food at the supermarket in kilograms and grams. And while they do drink pints of beer at the pub its litres of spirits and 75 cl of wine. Its just a matter of time before we are completely metric. marsbar_man 12:56, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pint

The article states:

Draught beer and cider are the only goods that may not be sold in metric units in the United Kingdom; the only legal measures for these drinks when sold on draught are 1/4 pint (190 ml) (rarely encountered), ½ pint (284 ml) and multiples of the latter.

1/4 pint is 142 ml; 190 ml is nearly equal to 1/3 pint. What is it in fact, 1/4 or 1/3 ?? LHOON 13:00, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

1/3rd (a noggin)

[edit] Article cleanup

This article needs a serious looking at, the information is duplicated throughout and some bits seem a little bit biased.

[edit] Telegraph

The Telegraph still appears to be fairly anti-metric: there was a recent article quoting a weight as 2.2lbs - a figure which is uncannily close to 1kg. Perhaps a rough conversion by an anti-SI journalist?

82.21.250.171 20:29, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Metrication-uk-logo.gif

Image:Metrication-uk-logo.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 16:23, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:MetricbritainLogo.gif

Image:MetricbritainLogo.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 16:24, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Metrication a condition of accession? Unlikely!

I've marked this as dubious, because later events seem to contradict it. If its true, then why was there any need for the Council to issue a Units of Measure Directive? It's timing suggests that it was to achieve a common system of weights and measures to further the aims of the European Single Market. Does anyone have a citation that confirms or denies either position? --Red King (talk) 22:36, 31 May 2008 (UTC)