User talk:Markles/Archive 1

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This is Archive 1 of User_talk:Markles. It was archived on June 15, 2006.

This talk Page is all about Templates.

[edit] {{Current U.S. Senators}}

Please do not remove the "(R)" or "(D)" markers from this template:

  • On my computers, the colors are currently too light for me to distinguish Republican from Democrat.
  • Even if the colors were to be made dark enough (which I doubt — see Template talk:Current U.S. Senators#Colors problem), there are still people in this world who are color blind, and they would not be able to distinguish Republican from Democrat.
  • There are people who use text-based browsers, such as lynx, and therefore do not get the benefits of color.
  • Software that allows blind people to browse the Internet replies on the text stream and, again, cannot handle color.

Thanks, — DLJessup (talk) 23:54, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] {{US house elections}}

You are welcome. I see you are working on several wikiprojects of some interest to me, but that I never have time to work on. Keep up the good work. NoSeptember 21:21, 9 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] {{US-stub}}

The problem with using |* in the category link is that then all the articles it is used on get filed under * in the category. The articles get put in the category just fine without that, and other stub templates do not use |* --Mairi 22:52, 19 October 2005 (UTC)

Yup. You're right. I wasn't thinking right. Thanks for the heads-up! Mark Adler 00:13, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] {{U.S.A. State Congressional Delegation Article}}

I noticed you have added the category:state government to the Template "U.S.A. State Congressional Delegation Article". I do not think this is correct, because the "federal" representatives are not a part of "state" government. A category such as "state politics" would make more sense. --DuKot 03:27, 8 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] {{UnitedStatesCode}}

Per your question -- I have responded at Template talk:UnitedStatesCode, to make it easier for people in the future to follow the discussion. --Arcadian 20:34, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

... er... didn't realise there was already a template so I created a new one for use in my documenation of the USA PATRIOT Act. It's called {{usc}} (also created {{usc-clause}}. I worked out how to send parameters directly to the script - you might want to have a look at it. - Ta bu shi da yu 16:43, 19 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] {{NavigationBox}} & {{SuccessorSeries}}

[edit] &#124;

Indeed, it's quite useful - you can produce any character in this way (&#charcode;), which is often neater that using <nowiki> tags. ed g2s • talk 01:35, 2 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] {{NavigationBox}}

Thanks for your help on the navigation box! savidan(talk) (e@) 19:16, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

  • You're welcome. Always glad to help!—Markles 19:23, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
  • I cannot stand the Commas, I just really don't like it--Jack Cox 12:01, 26 April 2006 (UTC)
  • Hi Markles, thanks for all the good work on your templates. As for the comma/pipe debate, I personally prefer using a bullet in Navigation boxes. For an example, see {{Tufts_Presidents}}. I think that the bullet more prominent than the pipe and comma, making the templates easier to read. However, if I had to choose between commas and the pipe character, I would also opt for the comma. I much prefer having the font larger than what Jack Cox is arguing for. His font is just a little too small to read, and your font size appears to be the standard. I've been following the edit/reversion wars he's been waging against you and I am almost always am on your side. It does not please me that he seems so unwilling to compromise or let anyone else edit "his" templates. Let me know if you ever need any help and I'll be happy to lend my opinion to a discussion or help make necessary changes. Keep up the good work! --CapitalR 10:58, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
  • Can you show me what bullets look like in a list longer than Tufts?—Markles 11:05, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
  • Hi Markles, I just converted all of the governor templates to the NavigationBox form. I decided to go with bullets for now, but will change them all to be whatever is agreed upon by consensus in the NavigationBox talk page. Let's hope Jack won't revert all these again. Take it easy, --CapitalR 10:39, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Changes to {{NavigationBox}}

I had to revert your changes to Template:NavigationBox; something went wrong and most of the examples got included with the template. Choess 18:12, 25 May 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Navigation Box Categorization

[edit] Uncategorized navigational boxes

Hi Markles, I know you do a lot of navigation box work, so you might find this list I'm putting together interesting: User:CapitalR/Uncategorized navigational boxes. It's a work in progress, but it aims to find every single navigation box in English Wikipedia so they can be categorized and possibly standardized. I'm going to spend most of my time over the next few weeks working through the 40,000 templates finding all of the navigation boxes (with the help of a few bots), but feel free to distribute this page to anyone you know who might want to help start sorting, categorizing, and converting some to the NavigationBox form. --CapitalR 16:58, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

  • Great! Just a quick look at them… hmm… that's a lot of work ahead…! The templates {{89th Senate}} through {{109th Senate}} can get tfd'd, if you like.—Markles 18:41, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Opera Navigational boxes

This is to explain that I am reverting your changes to the opera navigational boxes because opera is classified under performing arts not music. If you wish to make a performing arts navigational boxes cat, that's fine, otherwise I'd be grateful if you could leave this. It's not helpful. If you want to discuss it you can write to my talk page where you can see the work I have done with the Opera project. Thank you. Kleinzach 12:43, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

  • OK. I've put it under Category:Performing Arts navigational boxes. —Markles 13:41, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] {{US Congress by State}}

Thanks for updating the "U.S." links to "United States". I was just about to do that; you saved me some time! ~ Ross (ElCharismo) 20:44, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

  • Always glad to help out! By the way, check out my new combination edits to the template. ({{US Congress by State}}). —Markles 20:51, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
Very nice. ~ Ross (ElCharismo) 22:10, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Succession Box WikiProject

I have created a new WikiProject for succession boxes located at Wikipedia:WikiProject Succession Box Standardization. Now we can discuss what needs to be fixed in a forum and make it into a larger project among Wikipedians. Not that I want too much infighting, but we all have had some disagreements and never know where to discuss them, so now we have a place. Come and join. Don't forget to sign the participant list if you want in.
–Whaleyland 22:14, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Infobox…

On a related note, I've been working on the Jeff Miller article, and I noticed that the template {{Infobox Representative}} says it's a canidate for deletion. Is there something I should use instead? Disavian 15:38, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

  • I don't know anything about that infobox template. I'm not a big fan of infoboxes of that nature— I think they're overused. If at all, am article about an individual ought to use a generic infobox not one specific infobox for Presidents, Senators, Reps, etc.—Markles 16:33, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
    • Have a particular infobox in mind? Disavian 16:54, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
      • Sorry, none that I've liked so far. There are lots of problems with personal infoboxes. For example, they reduce a person to a single job (usually, the "highest ranking" one). —Markles 19:06, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
        • So, for the infobox on Jeff Miller, you can't think of a suitable replacement? I'm thinking of doing whatever command that is that turns it into code independent of the template, and then deleting the "this is a canidate for deletion" bit. Disavian 03:34, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
          • An infobox, including that one, doesn't add anything to the article. It's just too much. Excessive. Unnecessary. (As are the 40 footnotes, which might be combined into fewer?) That infobox, by the way, has {{tfd}} built right into it. I can't figure out why.—Markles 06:14, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
            • I admit that I got a tad ref-zealous. Disavian 03:46, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
            • Now that you pointed out the {{tfd}}, I was able to figure out how to fix it. Disavian 03:58, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Governors templates

Look, If you can't read that's your own problem. I HAVE EVERY TEMPLATE THE SAME WAY, you taking over some of the work I've done because you can't read it is annoying. What I don't like is the fact that sometimes we get only one governor sitting on the last line and it looks bad!--Jack Cox 05:54, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

  • I'm sorry this is so annoying for you. Really!! I like a lot of the work you've contributed here! But it is Wikipedia policy that users do not own the articles they write. Others "will boldly and mercilessly edit what you write" (Wikipedia:Be bold in updating pages). You have contributed a lot of fantastic articles and templates, but once you click on "Save page" it is no longer yours and it will fall victim to a future editor's eye. In short- You just can't be upset that someone has edited "your" articles.
  • You'll get one governor sitting on the last line (what typographers call "orphans") whenever the user's computer has a certain viewing width. That will be very hard, if not impossible, to prevent here. Basically, you have to try to consider many users. I understand you don't like how it looks on your screen, but there are many other users who don't use your OS or your browser or your skin, etc.
  • When you say "every template" I'm guessing you mean every Governor Template. There are, as I wrote on your discussion page, many more templates, such as {{USPresidents}}, {{Canada}}, {{NobelPrizes}} and hundreds more listed at Category:Navigational templates and Wikipedia:Navigational templates. A vast majority of them don't use text as small as what you've employed. Very often, an article will use multiple templates and similar templates ought to have similar formatting. (Check out the templates at the bottom of Franklin D. Roosevelt.) At least, that's my opinion… consistency is good for the reading eye.
  • I welcome your response. —Markles 12:44, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
    • Okay I understand that its for the reading eye but my personal problem is that I just think the boxes look better with small text and I know it's hard to read but can you not just up the size of your internet text?--Jack Cox 03:50, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
    • I think I've found a solution, you state wikipedia says to be BOLD! So guess what I found you can really enliven the text and make it bigger with the bold tool!--Jack Cox 04:09, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
      • Alas, small & bold looks even worse. But more important is this question: If you want them to be consistent, why not make them consistent with other tempaltes? Look at {{USPresidents}}, {{Canada}}, {{NobelPrizes}} and hundreds more listed at Category:Navigational templates and Wikipedia:Navigational templates. A vast majority of them don't use text as small as what you've employed. Very often, an article will use multiple templates and similar templates ought to have similar formatting. (Check out the templates at the bottom of Franklin D. Roosevelt.) Furthermore, why not use {{SuccessorSeries}}, which keeps consistency among templates? —Markles 11:39, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
      • I want you to give me your email so we can talk this over because i honestly think we are going to need to come to a compromise on this--Jack Cox 19:11, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
        • I'm sorry, I can't give you my email. I would rather discuss it here on my wiki talk page so other wiki editors can join in. Did you look at Franklin Roosevelt-- do you see what I mean? —Markles 21:12, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
        • I understand your point but what your doing by enlarging the text size is your destroying the beauty of the work. I'm sorry that might be the way i see it but I honestly believe that we need a concensus on this. I might see a few experiments to see if we can get what you like.--Jack Cox 00:07, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
        • Okay, I'm going to let you have the big text but the arrangement it going to be of my choosing okay?--Jack Cox 00:13, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
          • No. I can't compromise because I have no authority to compromise. This is not my Wikipedia. Some future editor may come along and change everything you and I have done. That's just how it goes: If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly or redistributed by others, do not submit it. However, one ought to have good debatable reasons for editing. —Markles 03:08, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
            …
            I'm sorry, I'm in a cranky mood. I've had a lousy day and I shouldn't be taking out on you. Mea culpa. Do what you think is best and I'll leave it alone. —Markles 03:20, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] {{USCongDistState}}

I noticed that you created 53 templates to be used by the {{USCongDistState}} template for numbering the congressional districts (USCongDistState1, USCongDistState2, ..., USCongDistState53). I've replaced the functionality of these 53 templates with a new one called {{USCongDistStateList}}. Let me know what you think of the new template, and your opinion on the possibily of eliminating the 53 other templates. Cheers, --CapitalR 04:49, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

  • You did a great job! I'm thrilled!! :)
  • You can {{tfd}} those numbered templates, now!
    • {{USCongDistState1}} - {{USCongDistState9}} and
    • {{USCongDistState01}} - {{USCongDistState53}}.
  • (By the way, you can use {{tl}} instead of {{t1}}.)
  • —Markles 10:44, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] {{USRepSuccessionBox}}

I noticed your edits to Template:USRepSuccessionBox, and I think the concept was a good idea. However, I think the text in the succession box is a bit bulky. I tried to adjust it but the template is quite complicated, so I just thought I would suggest it to you instead and perhaps you could implement it. For example, instead of Member of the U.S. House of Representatives from Maryland's 8th congressional district, I was thinking of something that is more concise and flows better: Representative of the 8th Congressional District of Maryland. Thoughts? Thanks. --tomf688 (talk - email) 18:31, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

  • You're right: it is clunky. I don't know if there's a better title, though. It's a compromise between accurate and concise as well as I could imagine at the time I created the template. I suppose Representative of Maryland's 8th congressional district would work, but I'm not thrilled about it. There's been a bit of discussion already about calling someone a "Representative" or a "Member of the house of reps…" How about you move this discussion (and copy our bits too) to Template_talk:USRepSuccessionBox, and see if anyone else has any thoughts? After all, it's not up to me: Wikipedia is a consensus-run vehicle.—Markles 19:13, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template moves

I hope you're planning to fix double-redirects that have resulted from the recent move of Template:USPoliticalDivisions. I normally would point something like this out to an experienced user but you seem to have continued on with moving other templates rather than fixing the resulting double-redirects. Cheers. older ≠ wiser 14:48, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template renaming doesn't work well :-(

Hi Markles,

I'm sorry to tell you that the template you've renamed (Template:USPoliticalDivisions) doesn't function well under its new name: it cannot display the chart it is supposed to, only a message:

  1. REDIRECT Template:USPoliticalDivisions

I've replaced it in the article U.S. state but afterwards I realized it should be replaced in the articles of all the other U.S. states to work properly (see its Whatlinkshere page for the list). Looks like you have (I think) three choices:

  • you can find and ask a robot (or rather, its owner) to replace the template name in all the related articles,
  • you can replace the template names manually in every article,
  • you can move back the template to its original name.

I think it would not be fair to leave the template as it is, since at the moment it's not functional and spoils the view of some fifty articles.

Yours, Adam78 15:00, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template:DelawareUSS

Nice work on the (now) DEHistory template. You fixed a problem I never could figure out. I've got a couple of concerns about the DelawareUSS changes though.

  • Do you think we could do without the "(alphabetical order)" note in the header? Cosmetically its not attractive, and the list is obviously alpha. I actually believe all these sorts of templates should be alpha, because its the only way to find someone if the chronology is unknown. How does that idea get promoted?
  • The line between the people and the "see also" is nice, but it takes up way too much space. Is there a way to squish it, so there is only one line's worth of white space. These templates stack nicely (see Thomas R. Carper), but I would want them all to look the same and too much white space might be a distraction. What do you think?

BTW what's with the attention all of a sudden on Templates. Between you and Netoholic, I feel like a ping pong ball- moving the right direction though. stilltim 17:25, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

I agree that the alpha note in header is ugly. You can nix it.
I actually like chron navigation lists. Alph lists don't tell you anything you don't already know, and if you need to find a name quickly just use your browser's "find/search" feature (usually alt-F or apple-F). However, you're welcome to get a discussion going against this idea. Where? I don't know. I suppose you could start at Wikipedia:Navigational templates or Wikipedia:Village Pump.
To nix the superfluous whitespace, I try remove all breaks between templates. Check out Thomas R. Carper now.
Sorry about the ping-pong silliness with Netoholic. Netoholic a very really alert Wikipedia repairer, while I just suddenly got a on a kick about navigational templates.