Talk:Lachit Borphukan

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I am using materials from http://www.hvk.org/articles/0801/92.html which may be copyrighted. However as this is a speech by Lt Gen S K Sinha, I don't think there might be any issues. Knowledgable persons, please have a look into the issue and advice.

Moreover, some fine tuning is still required. I am working on them. Works to do:

  • Proof reading & language correction
  • Putting ref links
  • Better writing, if possible with some ref.s to years.

...

Contents

[edit] MOVED

abidwasim has moved this article from "Lachit Borphukan"to "Lachit Borphukan, The Great Commander", as to enlist his name in the wiki article "List_of_people_known_as_The_Great" —Preceding unsigned comment added by Abidwasim (talk • contribs) 07:28, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Text

  • There is an ambiguity in the sentence containing the name Momai Tamuli. It was Momai Tamuli who rose to Borborua from humble beginnings, not Lacit. And Borborua is the governor of upper Assam, not lower Assam (I changed it), and a Borbarua could be called the Commander-in-Chief (though this is not clear, because sometimes the Burhagohain became the commander-in chief) of the Ahom army. But is that what you mean? Chaipau 14:16, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Yes, ambiguity is there. I'll try to fix it. I am not sure whether a Borbarua equivalent to C-in-C, I think this is a rather civil administrative post. As for Burhagohain to be C-in-C, I am not sure about that either. As far as I know, Burhagohain, along with Borgohain & Borpatragohain (later added) was the supleme trio with the highest power after the king. The power of these three together may even axceed the king's power at times. Obviously, Burhagohain, being the highest office holder minister, had a lot of power over the army also. but could he be called C-in-C? Not sure.
As far as I am aware, there was no Commander-in-Chief in the Ahom army, because there was no Ahom standing army. Each military campaign had its own field commander, decided on a per-case basis, with foot soldiers from among the paiks. There are examples of Xandikois, Phukans and Neogs leading different campaigns. For the Battle of Saraighat, Atan Burhagohain did provide support and a second flank at the rear, if I remember correctly. It must have been one of the best defensive campaigns in world military history. To bring that out, we need to do some military research.
Another great general from Assam was Chilarai. Chaipau 15:05, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Most probably you are right about everything you mentioned. I am using the "most probably" that I am also writing from memory because I am not having access to authentic assamese literature where I am staying (Silchar). There are not much available on the 'net also. I'll try to visit a library next time I go to Guwahati & bring some more facts.
As far as military research is concerned, Gen S K Sinha already have done some. We need to find some way of getting access to his work, if possible contact him (I think this will be very tough, if not impossible). Please give some idea where to start.
I am very much aware about Chilarai. He also needs national/international focus.
  • An alternative spelling for the name is Lacit. In other pages on Wikipedia, the "Lacit" spelling has been used. Would you consider changing the spelling to Lacit? It is also closer to the way the Assamese pronounce the name. It is not very difficult to do. Just move the page to "Lacit Borphukan", without the quotes. It will create a redirect from the Lachit Borphukan page to Lacit Borphukan. Chaipau 14:16, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)
I think although assamese people don't pronunce the "pratham cha" or the ch sound hard, if we use Lacit instead of Lachit, non-assamese speakers might interprete it as Lakit. So I am for keeping Lachit rather. What do you say? (I'll try to give the IPA transcription) Prabhakar 05:52, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)
The IPA transcription would be very good.
Generally, different native speakers have different English transliteration schemes, and they are likely to interpret it differently. If you want to target just the north Indian speakers, Lachit might be a good idea. But others might still mistake it. For example, a native English speaker from North America would pronounce Lachit as "lak-hit". No matter what you do, someone will pronounce it wrongly. Therefore, it is best to keep spellings in all languages (not just in Assamese) in the native style. For example, "Mbeki" is pronounced "Embeki". Yet the African people stick to the way they spell it. The French know that people will pronounce their name correctly only if they insist others follow the French convention. Chaipau 15:05, 21 Feb 2005 (UTC)
This pronunciation of "ch" as a kind of aspirated "k" prevails in scotland/ireland and in some east european countries also (e.g. Loch Ness). I had once a discussion with Prof Tabu Taid (probably you know him) and I remember him saying that this sound is not very much common in English. I'd still stick to Lachit (but if you insist, I have no objection to adopt Lacit). Prabhakar 03:58, 23 Feb 2005 (UTC)
In some languages it has the "x" sound (e.g Bach). As you can see, "ch" has different sounds different languages. The north Indians will pronounce it the hard "ch" way. The North Americans will pronounce it as either "k" or "k-h". The Germans might pronounce it as "x". And none of this comes close to the way the Assamese speak it. So it is best to keep it the way the Assamese spell it, or in a way that will invite others to ask a native speaker how to pronounce it.
This seems like a minor point. But it is an important principle if you consider the way we have generally introduced so much noise in these issues. Chaipau 09:16, 23 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Should we put a paragraph for Lt Gen S K Sinha for his work on Lachit Borphukan? Prabhakar 08:11, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Suggestions
    • Maybe a paragraph of his work on Lachit Borphukan in Gen S K Sinha's own page. The credit of his work goes to him, not to Lachit Borphukan. You may refer to his work at the bottom of the page, which you have already done.
    • Most of the material actually goes under a separate article Battle of Saraighat.

Chaipau 20:12, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Battle of Saraighat Vs Lachit

I thought putting the portion on Battle of Saraighat would be relevent as I am trying to put it emphesizing Lachits credits, even at the cost of duplicacy of 4/5 lines.

Prabhakar 08:17, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)

[edit] How about now?

Please go through the re-edited article. I have moved a great portion to Battle of Saraighat.

Prabhakar 09:36, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)

That is wonderful. Thanks. Chaipau 14:16, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)

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If anyone's watching this article, I suggest that they go through the text with a little care and remove some of the peacocking. I'd prefer not to do it myself... Relata refero (talk) 12:27, 8 March 2008 (UTC)