Talk:Kristen Pfaff

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Deleted the "Conspiracy Theory" section on this page. It was 1. Extremely Biased, 2. Extremely stupid 3. Not sourced, and 4. Ignorant. I hope it does not appear again.

I've edited it back in. The conspiracy theories themselves may be stupid, but they're out there, and thus warrant inclusion just as much as the conspiracy theories on Cobain's death warrant inclusion on his page, or the conspiracy theories surrounding JFK's assassination on JFK's page, or anything else. As there's no actual assertions in there other than noting what OTHERS allege (and it makes it clear that is the case) I don't see how it's potentially libellous. Tbh I think you're bringing rather a little too much POV - that you like Courtney due to being a Hole fan and find it distasteful that some people think such things. That's not exactly NPOV editing, is it now. Charlycrash (talk) 18:54, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Contents 1 New content 2 Headers 3 Kristen Conspiracy Theory 4 Vandalism ?

[edit] New content

I've added some stuff to the Musical Career section, given a bit of info about Janitor Joe's releases, the Minneapolis scene, and Kristen's role in JJ's sound. I'll set up a rudimentary JJ page so the tree is better... I have a couple of questions, though, about the spring 1994 tour K played with JJ: Did she replace Wayne Davis (her replacement in JJ) or join as a second live bassist? Did she have any input into Lucky, the 1994 album? Anyone?

Kristen's work on LTT deserves discussion, too, since Love/Erlandson/Pfaff/Schemel is so often regarded as the classic lineup of Hole. I'll check the Hole discography for writing credits and add some reviews that focus on Kristen. Everett True's book, Live through this - American Rock in the 90's, talks about her playing style and a couple of reviews really champion her.

I've also added a bit of context to her decision to move to Seattle. Seattle Weekly.com is down, so I can't cite right now, but the quote from her father is reproduced and cited in Courtney Love: Queen of Noise, by Melissa Rossi.

White hotel 10:00, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

The Janitor Joe page is now up. Should I link it to the Hole tree?

I've separated her musical career section into Janitor Joe and Hole, and changed the 'Drugs and death' section to 'Seattle and after', adding some quotes from Spin and info from Rolling Stone. I will continue to expand the Hole section - there's lots of stuff available about the recording of LTT and its impact.

White hotel 15:36, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Headers

'Drugs and death' is a dreadful header title. Is this page chronological or thematic? Maybe we should have a 'musical career' section and a 'biographical info' section. Very little substantiable info is available about Kristen until very late in her life. I think we have to be careful not to let a biographical approach overshadow her career.

White hotel 12:42, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Kristen Conspiracy Theory

This is a terrible article that addresses little about the subject and instead focuses on spreading hysterical Courtney Love conspiracies. This is one of the pitfalls of having random people create encyclopedia passages. This page needs to be changed.

The quotes here are from the book "Who Killed Kurt Cobain?" published in 1998 so I don't see how re-using quotes could be considered libelous, and as for the rest of the article, I didn't read anything that wasn't the truth.

Just because it comes from a book doesn't make it accurate. And Wiki, why don't you edit then since no one else will.

I agree I couldn't help but think this was so obviously manipulative reading this article. I would never have known this information came from a book without reading the discussion page and I'm quite sure numerous people won't read this page. --68.50.23.9 11:47, 6 August 2005 (UTC)

If you click the little numbers in square brackets throughout the text it'll take you to the link to the source. Those little numbers means things are from other sources. Charlycrash (talk) 19:05, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

The fact that it comes from a book also doesnt mean its inaccurate. There also is a tendency to believe that all "conspiracy theories" are wrong, which is ludicrous.

The article needs to be edited as everbody says, I put one of these at the top {{NPOV}}--FlareNUKE 23:52, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Just because one person doesn't like it doesn't mean it's biased. They took a vote and decided to keep the page. Find something better to do and let it go.

The conspiracy theory is rather baseless speculation, and considered the standards applied to other, more visited pages, I'm surprised it hasn't been removed. There is no evidence or justification given, and the source is barely a step above something like The Weekly World News. Wikipedia doesn't credit such sources so it's surprising that in this case, anything goes as long as it's in book form. You can find books that say nearly anything, it doesn't mean they are legitimate, credible sources, or that speculation without any evidence, when published as a book, is a valid source. A closer examination of the content and the actual quality of the source itself would have better served this article in this case. 10:40, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

The conspiracy theories surrounding Cobain's death are, frankly, also pretty ridiculous, yet they're still on his page. Honestly, most conspiracy theories are pretty ridiculous, but I don't see why noting the existence of such theories and describing them to some degree is anything other than desirable provided that the article makes it clear that it's listing ALLEGATIONS MADE BY OTHERS and not listing facts. It's impossible to talk about JFK without talking about grassy knolls and second gunmen - how are the Pfaff conspiracies any different? Certainly not weight of evidence, as the JFK conspiracies also dissolve easily with a few well-chosen hard facts. Charlycrash (talk) 19:05, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Yes but this isn't Kennedy this a pretty much just some rock musician from the 90's who was a junkie, it's fairly different. 156.110.50.6 (talk) 16:10, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Excuse me, who took what vote and decided to keep what page? I veto the conspiracy theory section. It's based on one person's input, whose input is extremely biased -- it should go on THAT person's page, not Kristen's. Mistertruffles (talk) 07:29, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism ?

I am not sure whether the recent edit by 'Jnggobills' is valid. it's something about 'losing her "flag"' Can someone please verify ? SiegerKranzMeer 05:27, 1 March 2008 (UTC)