User talk:KitchM

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[edit] Welcome

Hello, KitchM! Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. You may benefit from following some of the links below, which will help you get the most out of Wikipedia. If you have any questions you can ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages by clicking or by typing four tildes "~~~~"; this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you are already loving Wikipedia you might want to consider being "adopted" by a more experienced editor or joining a WikiProject to collaborate with others in creating and improving articles of your interest. Click here for a directory of all the WikiProjects. Finally, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field. Happy editing! Rosiestep (talk) 06:33, 6 April 2008 (UTC) Getting Started Wikipedia Tutorial • The five pillars of Wikipedia How to: edit a page • upload an image Getting Help Frequently Asked Questions Where to ask questions or make comments Request administrator attention Policies and Guidelines Neutral point of view • Reliable sources Verifiability • Citing sources • No original research What Wikipedia is not • Biographies of living persons Manual of Style • Three-revert rule • Sock puppetry Copyrights • Policy for non-free content • Image use policy External links • Spam • Vandalism Deletion policy • Conflict of interest • Notability The Community Community Portal • Adopt-a-user program Assume good faith • Civility • Etiquette No personal attacks • Resolving disputes Build consensus • Village pump Signpost • IRC channels • Mailing lists Things to do Be bold in editing • Help develop an article Pages needing attention • Peer review Join a WikiProject • Translating articles Cleaning up: General • Spam • Vandalism Miscellaneous Categories • Disambiguity • Stubs User pages • Talk pages Useful templates • Tools • User scripts

[edit] Welcome too

I appreciate your contributing to the Sabbath article! As a new editor you may not be aware of several Wikipedia methods (there's a learning curve for everyone), but it looks like Rosiestep has provided a good list. I have tried to incorporate your text in more appropriate places. Please take a moment to read some of the standards linked above and/or below and it will greatly assist you in learning where best to place content like this and how to keep it neutrally stated. Rest assured that I likely share your strong feelings about Sabbath, but we do well not to let those feelings spill out into content which may require balancing by others.

• Most important, learn about neutral point of view and how statements that could be challenged by other editors should be balanced by stating all significant points of view without undue weight.
• Guidelines about lead sections indicate that the lead of this article should stay about a paragraph long.
• Summary style guidelines indicate that most content about this topic should appear in subarticles instead of the summary article: e.g., Shabbat and Sabbath in Christianity would be good ones to start.
• The distinction between which usages are "God-ordained" and which are "ritual or ceremonial", like the capital and lowercase distinction, is not easily described nor easily agreed. There are many points of view among reliable sources and Wikipedia is not regarded as a source for promotion of any one view at the expense of others.
• Phrases like "the most ancient finds of archeological writings" are vague and unqualified and need to be verified by reliable sources with specifics. Phrases like "one can easily understand that" should be avoided because they editorialize on the topic's understandability rather than make it understandable.
• Which command is it originally? Moses didn't say, actually. Counting imperative statements like Maimonides did might make Sabbath the fifth. While it may (or may not) be true that "fourth" is the most accurate, it is not suitable for a neutral encyclopedia unless it is also verifiable. See Ten Commandments#Division of the Commandments.
• "The most precise definition has been determined to be": by whom? And has everyone agreed suddenly? If you have a source, then go to one of the subarticles, cite and attribute your source, and place it among the other folks who happen to disagree that this is what "the most precise definition has been determined to be".
• Remember that, as the article hints, Biblical Sabbath and Saturday are not identical; the latter begins at midnight. Precision is essential!
• Similarly, if Sabbath had actually been originally referred to in Bible times as the phrase "Lord's Day" in some language, it would be easier to get away with saying that! But since "Sabbath of the Lord" is (slightly) different from "Lord's Day", we are not permitted to equate the two on our own. On Wikipedia that is called original research.

I know this may seem like a lot suddenly, so just take it slowly. When one wants to edit in historically controverted areas, it just means taking a little more time to ensure sensitivity to the concerns of all. Look at the article history of Sabbath for some ways in which I incorporated your thoughts into the existing structure of the article. I'm looking forward to your continuing to make positive contributions to the project! JJB 10:14, 11 May 2008 (UTC)