Talk:Khariboli

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Addded Hindi Devanagari and Urdu Naskh. A mention here should be made that the historical Khariboli is considered by many linguists to be the common ancestor of modern Hindi and Urdu - especially as that subject can become so contentious and devolve into nationalistic rants. Khirad^talk 02:12, 22 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] anyone opposing its merger with hindi

is there anyone opposing this page's merger with Hindi. as for a fact, when discovery channel launched its operations in india, it used khariboli for its Hindi channel, and it didnt called the language khari boli, it simply called it discovery channel in HINDI. nids 09:52, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

Yes I think most people oppose merging it. Khariboli is a distinct dialect, different from braj basha, and awadhi that some people consider were previous standard dialects of Hindi. Khari boli has a unique history and usage that is different from the language hindi which some scholars speak of as a dialect continuum or a collection of dialects. Khari boli is just one of those. - Taxman ^Talk 18:47, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

if u think that khariboli is a different dialect of hindi, than for ur knowledge, the page on Hindi on this wikipedia, mentions that everything that it talks about hindi, (from grammer to diction) is for khari boli and it does not cover other dialects. u can check the official view in Indian constitution too. it too mentions khari boli to be the proper hindi, rest being dialects.

nids 19:28, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

Yes, standard Hindi was defined to be that of the Khari boli dailect plus a few modifications. That doesn't mean Hindi=Khari boli. Hindi is Khari boli plus other dialiects under the definition most linguists use for Hindi. Thus Khari boli is worth discussing as it's own unique features. We certainly don't need to duplicate material from Hindi, just describe it as a dialect that was chosen as the official one. - Taxman ^Talk 21:18, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

i think it shall be better if we merge Khari boli with Hindi and define other dialects as different. officially and grammatically, shudhh hindi is no different from Khari boli. all its unique features can be discussed in Hindi. there is no need to duplicate material here, and this page can be altoghether deleted. nids 18:27, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

This article isn't duplicating much of anything from Hindi. There is no space in the Hindi article for all this detail on Khari boli, so therefore it doesn't make sense to merge in. As I've already said, and you're conveniently sidestepping, Hindi is a broader term and does not mean the same thing as Khari boli. Khari boli and Shudha Hindi are nearly the same thing, but in general the term Hindi includes other dialects too. - Taxman ^Talk 19:54, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

There is absolutely no need for this article. Khariboli and Hindustani are one and the same thing. Hindi and Urdu are two different things, if not languages, and separate articles for them is justified. But khariboli is not different from Hindustani, since the term can be used with respect to Hindi as well as with respect to Urdu. However we can put extra names in the other articles, for example, Hindi(also called High Hindi, Shuddha Hindi, Khariboli Hindi,...) and so on. Maquahuitl (talk) 18:26, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

I don't think this page needs to be merged, as it is suitably small and basically accurate, knowing its place and relation to the construct Hindi. Tuncrypt (talk) 03:03, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

As for the original proposal, definitely NO. Khariboli is just one Hindi language - it's like asking to merge Mandarin into Chinese, or Italian into Romance. Now, merging Khariboli and Hindustani is a different matter, which I don't feel strongly about either way, but it would mean that all the POV nonsense that people fight over in Hindustani would then affect the information now under Khariboli as well. kwami (talk) 08:02, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Actually, I think we should have two "Hindi" articles: Standard Hindi vs. something like Hindi dialects, just as we do Standard Cantonese, Standard Mandarin, etc. vs. Cantonese (linguistics) and Mandarin (linguistics). kwami (talk) 08:06, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Every major modern language has many dialects but one standard dialect. Italian is based on the Tuscan dialect (which has its own article). Standard Spanish came from dialects of the Northern region. The two de facto standard dialects in English are Received pronunciation (British) and General American) but there are plenty of other dialects. The standard/official dialect should have a separate page to the main language article. For example, we can't talk about poems written in Brij Bhasha and Awadhi in the Khariboli literature section whereas we can in the Hindi article. Gizza^{Discuss ©} 09:15, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Yes, but the difference between Italian and the set of languages considered under "Hindi" is that the set of Italian dialects would probably be having a recent common origin but the Hindi languages don't have a recent common origin, and if you try to go back in time other standardised languages merge with it too. As far as literature is concerned, it's a pretty messed up article as present. It should make clear what it is discussing- literature of all Hindi languages as a whole or just of the Khariboli dialect(which would make it converge towards Urdu literature).Maquahuitl^talk! 14:26, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] scope

does the scope of this article, or does it not, include Urdu? If it does, its scope is identical with Hindustani (merge there), if it does not, its scope is identical with that of Standard Hindi (merge there). If we are not sure which is the case, prehaps this should be a disambiguation page. dab (𒁳) 10:50, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

It should be merged with Hindustani. Both Hindi and Urdu, as literary and/or official forms are based on this dialect. Merging with either Standard Hindi or with Urdu would be unfair. The word Khariboli is used more in colloquial speech, whereas Hindustani is more popular with the linguists, and in fact even that has declined slightly in popularity to give way to the hyphenated term "Hindi-Urdu". However we are faced with the problem of doing justice to each of these terms and at the same time, not duplicating information in the process. Maquahuitl^talk! 11:35, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Four varieties

I strongly contest the claim made in the article about the four "varities" of Khariboli. What is that nonsense? Khariboli itself is a specific dialect. How can it have four varieties? Maquahuitl^talk! 15:01, 15 May 2008 (UTC)