Talk:Keyline design
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Hopefully arived at the most appropriate name for the page. Keyline/Keypoint didn't work as they are also terms used in typography. And as User:JSchinnerer pointed out its a more appropriate term than Keyline Planning. --Pfafrich 11:32, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
Text copied from private email as an interesting distinction. (hope you don't mind John)
I would like to suggest early on that the topic be changed to Keyline Design instead of Keyline Planning, not the least because Yeomans' site itself is called Keyline Designs (though he also uses 'plan' and 'planning' etc. somewhat interchangeably in the site and book); also because permaculturists in my experience refer to it as design rather than planning; also because it is IMO a complex design system, and more than simply a planning methodology.
Admittedly part of this is my desire to distinguish between 'Design' and 'Planning', at least as they are used and abused in American English. Perhaps they are much more interchangeably used to mean essentially the same thing in UK and/or Australian and/or New Zealand English...?
Anyhow, my background and experience makes a significant distinction between 'design' and 'planning' and keyline looks much more like design.
In brief, 'design' is in general a non-linear iterative process that always considers a variety of contextual scales and seeks to expand perspective/ask 'larger' questions to inform the decision-making and implementation of whatever is being designed (for).
'Planning' is in general a more linear process that typically assumes and operates within a relatively fixed context of 'problem'/'issue' and 'solution', and decision-making is informed primarily from within the initially determined context.
I can wax more rhetorical/give examples if you want, that's enough for now...just curious as to your take on that distinction. I suspect most permaculturists would not appreciate what they do being called 'planning'...??
aloha, John S.
[edit] Article name
All due respect to John and the Wikipedian who posted the above considerations concerning this article's title. I suggest that neither "planning" nor "design" are appropriate for an encyclopedic article, unless they refer to Yeoman's copyrighted works by title. I think that a more generic, ergo more encyclopedic name would be Keyline principle. (Note the lower case second word, per Wikipedia:Naming conventions). In my opinion, and this may be verifiable, the term "keyline principle" is widely used in a more generic sense these days and as far as I can tell, the Yeomans family has no objections regarding this use. Asserting the title "Keyline Design" to the Keyline principle is like attaching "Bucky Balls" to fullerines. My two cents worth. • CQ 21:55, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
Keyline principals, or possibly Keyline concepts are more apt titles. A Keyline is a particular contour. A Keypoint is particular point in a valley floor. Both are topographical features my father, P.A Yeomans discovered. He and I devised the name "Keyline". It was originally a registered trademark for agricultural and town planning use. It is no longer. (In Australia, Keyline Design is a registered business relating to agriculture, and is owned by my brother.) Keyline principals cover topographical planning of a farm (or town ) and also procedures for the rapid enhancement of soil fertility. It also includes procedures for determining optimum farm dam location and also the actual construction procedures etc. Keyline principals thus include planning, design, soil development, dam construction, fence and road locations, and cultivation techniques. The conglomerate is usually referred to at schools and universities as "studying the principals of Keyline" Keyline principals thus seems the wisest title. The history of Keyline and its contrast with conventional soil conservation teachings I have covered in some detail in my book PRIORITY ONE Together We Can Beat Global Warming which includes using Keyline principals for the rapid sequestration of carbon dioxide into soil. PRIORITY ONE can be read on line at www.yeomansplow.com.au.
Allan Yeomans
I just want to add that keyline plowing is, in fact, NOT "Contour Plowing" but "plowing parallel to the keyline" which results in a pattern of going up in the valleys and down on the ridges. The whole point is that Contour plower leads to water draining into the valleys. -jordan fink
116.90.48.21 (talk) 07:56, 17 December 2007 (UTC) The original method of keyline, developed by P.A, used the chisel plow. This plow had a rather dramatic effect on the surface of the soil. When used on grazing lands, pasture loss was high. However, the pasture loss increased the organic matter available to the soil building process, as described by P.A.
The yeomans keyline plow was developed by Allen Yeomans. The new design of yeomans plows minimises surface disturbance, while loosening the subsoil. Although the yeomans plow minimises the effects of erosion, gradual mixing of soil horizons (over many years)is not as significant compared with the chisel plow.
Roots may not grow into a hostile subsoil, even if it has been loosened. For example, subsoil maybe toxic to plant roots. The importance of incorporating organic matter into the hostile subsoil over many years, was a keystone to the technique developed P.A, in my opinion.... -David B. 116.90.48.21 (talk) 07:56, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
