Talk:Kansai International Airport

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Contents

Surely "the most expensive blunder in human history" is a little hyperbolic? --Jpatokal

[edit] Codeshares

(rv: codeshares are not listed in airport articles, see Wikiproject Airports) Hi. Would you show me that which part of the Wikiproject Airports you mention about? And would you suggest if there is an alternative to describe codeshares instead of reversing the article immediately? Thank you. KGF 16:20 07 May 2006 (UTC)

Hello. It is found [here]. Look at the bullet where it says "Destinations" and it says that the list should not include the secondary carrier for codeshares. It has been a consensus here that we do not list codeshares since it is redundant, and the cities that are listed here should only be the cities where the airline's actual metal fly to. Elektrik Blue 82 20:00, 7 May 2006 (UTC)


Hi. I think you have not answered my question exactly.

Which part of "Wikiproject Airport" do you mention about?

As you may know, dab convention in the "Airport" wikiproject seems to be inconsistant with your premise based on the "Airlines" wikiproject convention. I think you should take proper processes such as discussing the matter on the Wikiproject Aiport's discussion page and so on, before you reverse boldly. What you did does not seem to be "productive". Thank you. KGF 02:20 08 May 2006 (UTC)

Check the link I gave you before. I repeat it here. Codeshares are not listed for the secondary carrier. Elektrik Blue 82 01:29, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi. I don't think "not listed" guarantees your right to reverse the article "immediately". "Not listed" means "room" for improvement through discussion. Do you agree, Mister? You may bring this matter on the discussion page of WikiProject Aiports first before reversing this specific article only. Thank you KGF 02:50 08 May 2006 (UTC)

I do not agree. You should bring this issue to the talk page of WikiProject Airports before adding the codeshare destinations of this particular airport only. Elektrik Blue 82 01:58, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

. It is your responsibility to do that because you reverse the articel based on "another WikiProject" conventions (where is your credibility? It's not just "nitpick", rather crucial). I just updated the article based on "dab" convention of WikiProject Aiports. And if you have any objections, please bring this matter on the discussion page of WikiProject Aiports first before reversing it. KGF 03:15 08 May 2006 (UTC)

Gentlemen, let's continue this discussion on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Airports#Codeshares. For what it's worth, I agree with Elektrik Blue 82 — the codeshare stuff adds lots of clutter and very little information. How about just tagging the codeshared flights under the primary carrier? So instead of this:
it would look like this:
Opinions welcome. Jpatokal 04:20, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Satellite photos

On the satelite photos, there appears to be construction of a second island beside the first one (I'm guessing they're part-way through filling it up). I'd guess this is for future expansion? The article should mention what's going on there. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 19:58, 5 Apr 2004 (UTC)

That would be the second runway, which is mentioned (briefly) in the last paragraph of the article. Jpatokal 02:38, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Yeah, that's what I figured. The new island looks to be larger that the old one - so maybe it will be the most expensive blunder in human history  :) -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 02:48, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Being an engineer who last passed through KIX yesterday, I'll have to file the current airport in the same category as the Pyramids: it's insanely cool even if it is a completely pointless waste of money. The second runway, on the other hand, is just stupid. Jpatokal 08:33, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Why is so? -- Taku 16:26, Apr 6, 2004 (UTC)
I'm sorry, I don't understand your question. If you mean my "most expensive blunder" comment, I'm just making a joke based on the comment at the top. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 16:30, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Sorry I was asking why people say the construction of the second run-way would be such expensive or it is waste of money. The sinking problem makes an off-shore airport this much hard and expensive or is there any other factor? I am not engineer so the conversation was interesting. Perhaps we could mention more detail about how the construction of this airport differs in terms of engineers and the profitability of the airport also. That would be very interesting to the readers. -- Taku 16:43, Apr 6, 2004 (UTC)
Well, I expect it's so expensive because they have to build the whole island from scratch. Worse, because Osaka is in an earthquake zone they have to build the island from rock or concrete. Other artificial islands (in other places) are built with trash or with material recovered from dredging operations - but these materials exhibit liquifaction during earthquakes, which means buildings would immediately sink or fall over. San Francisco airport, which also wants to expand its runways further into the bay, and is also located in an earthquake zone, has similar problems. So this makes KIX expensive to build, and (as the article says) means KIX needs to have expensive landing charges to try to recover the building cost. So airlines stay away (or go to the Kobe airport the article mentions). I don't envy the airport planners, however, as infrastructure planning is so very difficult to get right. You never know for sure that you'll need a new airport until it's too late. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 17:00, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)
And the reason why building a second runway is stupid is that the current single runway allows 160,000 takeoffs/landings per year, which is much more than current utilization (~129,000), and the utilization will decrease when Kobe Airport opens next year. So the 2nd runway is basically not needed in the foreseeable future, and building it "just in case" is pretty damn expensive. Jpatokal 23:54, 6 Apr 2004 (UTC)
That single bridge scares me. All it takes is for a "lucky" quake to loosen just one little part, or for some bozo in a tanker to prang one pillar, and the whole airport becomes useless for months. Someone miscalculated the tides on the River Clyde a while ago and consequently clunked the Erskine Bridge with an oil platform, rendering it unsafe for weeks (and that was just a scrape). -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 00:25, 7 Apr 2004 (UTC)
I would imagine that, in the absence of a bridge, they could just use the airport's ferry terminal to hydrofoil passengers to and from the airport. But you're right: there are a lot of design considerations that were sort of ignored in the construction of KIX. Sekicho 04:48, Apr 13, 2004 (UTC)
I see. I will try to reflect this in the article. -- Taku 17:22, Apr 6, 2004 (UTC)

30 billion dollars to build the new runway, or 30 billion yen? 30 billion dollars seems tremendously large, as that is 3 times larger than the cost of the entire Kobe Airport. --Golbez 01:05, 12 Apr 2004 (UTC)

[1] says 1.56 trillion yen for the 2nd phase alone, approx. $15 billion US at current rates. So $30 billion sounds like a reasonable estimate of the total... and yes, it is tremendously large! Kobe's size and shallow location are more reasonable. Jpatokal 03:23, 12 Apr 2004 (UTC)

"Kankuu" ("in the Kansai dialect") appears to be a contraction of the full name. Aren't we then saying this contraction is not used by other dialect speakers? As given the pronounciation does not appear to be dialectal, and it could be that usage of the term reflects regional rather than dialectal difference. But this is probably academic :) A-giau 08:11, 16 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I have always heard that Kankû is a Kansai-ben term. It's used in some official contexts (such as the JR Kankû-kaisoku train to the airport) but it's a word you would only hear around Osaka. Whether or not this is technically part of the dialect I can't say, because I'm not a linguist, but I have always heard the term cited as an example of Kansai-ben (see e.g. Palter and Horiuchi, Kinki Japanese, ISBN 0804820171). People from outside Osaka say Kansai-kûkô. Sekicho 13:05, Oct 16, 2004 (UTC)
If it is indeed used only by speakers fo that dialect, then it would, by definition, be part of that dialect.

---

[edit] Sinking problem

The article doesn't explain the "sinking problem" at all, it just assumes the reader already knows about it or can guess. Also, I think the "History" section should go before the "Outlook"

[edit] Some new images, if they're useful

Some new external images of the airport, please feel free to use in the article, if they help:

Main terminal

Exterior

main building + new runway

main terminal plus hotels

new runway

View from afar

-- All the best, Nickj (t) 07:40, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] outlook

It is number of domestic flights. (from these airport companies's HP)

KIX  : To 416 flights (per a week),20 airports. (Aug. 2006)

ITM  : To about 560 flights (per a week),28 airports. (Oct. 2003)

UKB (Kobe airport) has 196 flights (per a week),8 airports. (Oct. 2006).

These shows "It isn't most of domestic flights in Kansai from ITM and UKB.".

It shuld be rewrite it,I think.

galuboo 05:48, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

IAAF World Championships in Athletics will be held in Osaka in August 2007, not the World Expo. It should be checked.--219.67.22.15 15:57, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Hydrofoils

The Pearl Line website states in Japanese that they went out of business on April 1, 2007.

The Kansai Airport page for ferry transport (http://www.kansai-airport.or.jp/en/access/ferry/index.html) states that Kaijo Access Co. runs a high-speed ferry service to Kobe Airport, which costs 1500 yen for adults and 700 yen for children, and takes 30 minutes. To catch the ferry from KIX, first take the shuttle bus to the ferry terminal. The shuttle bus departs from stop No.12 just outside the airport passenger terminal 1st floor, and takes 6-8 minutes.

--61.46.27.12 04:44, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] KIX-NRT flights without fifth freedom rights

I don't think the Tahiti Nui/ANZ flights between KIX and NRT should be listed, as it's not possible to board them at KIX and fly to NRT or vica versa. I've raised the issue on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Airports. Jpatokal 03:15, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Only domestic?

I heard quite recently that there were plans to drop the 『国際』 (International) from the airport's name. I don't know if this is just a naming issue, or if it would actually mean a drastic change in which routes the airport serves. In any case, I can no longer find the relevant Asahi Shinbun article from roughly a week ago. Sorry.. .but if anyone does know anything, please do add it here. LordAmeth (talk) 06:25, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Is it about Itami airport? I think, may be this is one you seek. Asahi.com (Japanese 07/Dec./05) galuboo (talk) 13:52, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] On TV, I saw this airport, here in Brazil

I saw a TV program, here in Brazil, about the construction, of this airport.The program told that this is the most expensive airport ever.Is this true?At least compared to its capacity, this seems to be true. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.9.95.248 (talk) 03:39, 18 March 2008 (UTC)