Talk:Jeffrey R. Holland

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[edit] Removed Paragraph on Romney Campaign

I removed the paragraph on Holland's meeting with Romney's sons for two reasons. First, the facts of this meeting are widely disputed. Both Romney's campaign advisers and leaders of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints deny this being anymore than a courtesy call given to an old friend. Holland has stated that he was clear throughout the meeting the Church and it's resources could not be used for political purposes.

Secondly, and more importantly, this is irrelevant to the life of Jeffrey Holland. It gives no information as to who he is and what his major life accomplishments are. However, if the Wikipedian consensus is that this paragraph should definitely be included I would recommend moving it to a more appropriate location such as the page on Mitt Romney and his campaign. 140.247.237.75 03:42, 6 October 2007 (UTC)

Manticore55 21:13, 7 October 2007 (UTC)Members of the Church of Latter Day saints often dispute anything that they do not agree that conforms with their point of view of things regarding the church.. However, the source of the article is a mainstream newspaper. You cannot simply say 'it is irrelevant' for your convenience. Furthermore, it is extremely relevant to the life of Jeffery Holland, because Mitt Romney is a direct son of an apostle, of which Jeffery R. Holland is also a member. If Jeffery Holland is the person involved in the meeting, then it is relevant to Jeffery R. Holland's life.

Finally, and most important of all, the text in question is not stating factually that this is what Mr. Holland intended, it is stating what the newspaper reported as happening. I can begin to add more sources and more information to establish more content and context if you wish, but the fact is, that when a member of the Quorum of the Twelve meets with the son of a Member of the Quorum of the Twelve, who also happens to be a major presidential candidate, then that is important, it is timely, and it is relevant.

First, to clear some apparent confusion. Romney is not the son of any member of the Quorum of the Twelve. It wasn't Romney himself who met with Jeffrey Holland, it was Romney's son. Second, although I still believe that this paragraph would better belong in an article specifically about the Romney campaign, rather than reverting your changes I made an attempt to make it more NPOV. The facts of the meeting between Holland and Romney's son are disputed so I believe we should cite more sources than just the Boston Globe in this issue. I believe that the Deseret News article I referenced does a good job of showing the Church's and Romney's campaign's statements about the meeting.

I removed Mitt Romney's statement about it being obvious that he would seek support from members of the Church because it seems to be taken slightly out of context. There he was referring to his broader campaign strategy not to the meeting between his son and Holland. His other statements are very clear that the meeting was not for political purposes and that he respects the political neutrality of the Church.

You may disagree with me adding the word supposedly to the first sentence of the paragraph. I am trying to balance the opinions. Both sides agree that the meeting did occur but they differ when it comes to the purpose. I cast doubt on the Church's side as well by adding the word "insist" to their opinion.

Something we need to be careful to do is to make sure that we keep this paragraph limited. It should only discuss the part of the meeting relevant to Holland. We shouldn't turn it in an entire discussion of Romney and the church. That belongs elsewhere. We should also be careful to keep it short and succinct. It wouldn't by NPOV it we devoted more than a paragraph to a fifteen minute meeting when the most important aspect of Holland's life is his Church service. I look forward to working on this article with you and making it more NPOV. Heisenberg58 15:10, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

I Have to argee.I removed this paragrpah awhile back and then it seemed to get reverted back. But Now with Romney out and the Nomaintion almost certainly going to Mcain. It seems really Insinfance.The problem with wiki well one of the many is that these nerds with nothing better to try and cram any bit of infronmation they can. I Mean seriously is anyone going to gie a hoot about Elder Holland meeting with Romeny, down the line. No one cares that David O.Mckay met with Richard M. Nixon. I mean seriously. Plus the papragraph was written in a way to cast doubt on the church stance of politcaillt neturallity. which if you inssit that meeting has to be in the atricle. I mean we have do something to make this useless website seem like it matters than at least writre from a nertual stand point. Assuming there is such a thing_______Coalhouse —Preceding unsigned comment added by Coalhouse (talk • contribs) 02:37, 2 March 2008 (UTC)