Talk:Institutions of the European Union

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Good article Institutions of the European Union has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can delist it, or ask for a reassessment.
October 10, 2007 Good article nominee Listed
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Contents

[edit] Merger proposal

I'm proposing to merge in the institution section of European Union law. I'm really not sure why the European Union law should have an institutions section at all, so I'm proposing to move in any useful information into this article and then delete the section from the European Union law article. Caveat lector 01:21, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Agree, EU law has no need for the information, should be covered here. I'll start copying over useful information (if it does not have a citation then I will copy it here until it does or something so it doesn't bugger up the GA chances. - J Logan t: 17:00, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
Most of the info was duplcated or weaker, I've put in a section on acts and procedures though but all that data I've left on the law page as it is relevant there too. I've srunk that section down and given an overview for understanding but it still needs a general clean up like the rest of that article.
On the CoA point, it may not judge on laws but it is a judical body - it judges and controls the other institutions in a judical manner - even if it doesn't have cases as such, hence its name being that of "Court". It is too small to survive on its own (there is very little data on it anyway) and they ought to be kept seperate of the "political instituions" section - (and there is little point in a section called "institutions" in an article of that name). - J Logan t: 18:43, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Court of Auditors

copied from Talk:European Union

I know the sentence about the Court of Auditors looked a bit out of place in the main paragraph on governance, but the reason I moved it out it out of the legal system section was that, despite its name, isn't a law court and has almost nothing in common with either the Court of Justice or the Court of First Instance. I just feel that putting all of these courts together gives a misleading impression of the functions of these bodies which can only add to the confusion already created by the name of the Court of Auditors. Caveat lector 16:50, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

It is a judical body though. It may not deal with law but it is does not lie within the executive or legislative branches hence it would be misleading to place it with those. I reckon it makes more sence for judical bodies to me mentioned together, their overall role within the government is the same even if they are dealing with different elements. - J Logan t: 17:16, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

The Court of Auditors is not a judicial body. It does not have any judicial functions. Its name is a misnomer. The Europa website says the same thing. Caveat lector 23:59, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
You might also want to have a look at this quiz by the Oxford University Press. Caveat lector 00:39, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Even better, this official document issued by the Court of Auditors confirms that the court has no judicial powers. Caveat lector 01:13, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Oh I know it does not have judical powers, but its function is of a judical nature. In that it composed of judges that judge, if you know what I mean. - J Logan t: 14:31, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
No I don't think I do! The Court of Auditors is not composed of judges. They do not judge anything. There is no requirement that members have any legal experience. They are accountants. Caveat lector 21:52, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Since when did a judge have legal experience! And they judge the accounts. However thinking about it in this case do we even need to mention it? It is far from important and is only an institution to give it independence. (we still need to sort it out for the institutions page of course be we can continue this on that talk page?) - J Logan t: 14:09, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
Agree to disagree: The Court of Auditors is pretty insignificant. I'll remove the reference to if from this article and respond to you on the institution's talk page. Caveat lector 14:31, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
That's cheating! Its no fun if you agree to disagree! I demand you oppose my argument! :) - J Logan t: 15:33, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

For the case in point there is no separation of powers in the community. Both the Commission and the Council exercise both legislative and executive powers. Caveat lector 23:53, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Proposing legislation isn't exactly legislative power in the parliamentary sence. And yes the Council has both, but that seems to be changing with the European Council taking most of it on. Not sure what is left (aside from their own national implementation power). But how does that affect the CoA?
On the point though, to compromise we could have it as non-political instituions? However I think we need some expansion on the CoA information, there is very little but I can't think of anything to say about it. After all it is only an institution for legitimacy reasons. - J Logan t: 17:28, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] GA review

Hello, I am the GA reviewer of this article. If you have any questions regarding this GA review or GA reviews(of me) in general, do not hesitate to ask them. Regards, Daimanta 11:19, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

"Once a position is agreed, it has to be approved by Parliament again by an absolute majority"

wikilink "absolute maojority" , Daimanta 13:29, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Done. Caveat lector 15:50, 8 October 2007 (UTC)


In the background section I am kind of missing why the coal and steel union was formed. Can somebody insert a short reason why it was formed? Daimanta 17:49, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

The thing about this article is that I am missing the "why" of this article. This article lists all the institutions but not when or why they were formed. This needs to be elaborated. Regards, Daimanta 12:12, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

I'll see what I can do on these. It is a big question - esp. on ECSC - but I should be able to get something for you on this. - J Logan t: 17:30, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
How's that? - J Logan t: 18:38, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
The catch is the more history we include, the more we duplicate information in the History of the European Union article. Answering the question of why the institutions exist isn't really that different form answering the question of why the EU exists. Caveat lector 19:03, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
True, but duplicate information is always going to happen. If you leave it out, the article will become more like a list instead of a full fledged article. You can already see it by the references to the main article of every institution in every paragraph. I think it is necesairy for making THIS article comprehensible. The article should always stand on itself as much as reasonably possible. Regards, Daimanta 19:51, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
I have tried to give it more of a slant to the institutions, even though there is repetition of data in terms of treaties. I think it isn't too bad though as it is giving information about the institutions - I tried to steer away from giving too much info on why the ECSC was created, I don't think that is the principle of this article, it should be found in the others. - J Logan t: 09:39, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I think the article is GA worthy. I will wait 5 hours for any comments. After that I will grant it GA. Regards, Daimanta 10:58, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

GA review (see here for criteria)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose): b (MoS):
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars etc.:
  6. It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
  7. Overall:
    Pass/Fail:

Ok, the article has passed. I would like to thank the authors of this article for making this a GA and Caveat Lector and JLogan for completing my requests. Regards, Daimanta 17:55, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the work! - J Logan t: 18:36, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Similarities with Germany?

There is a section dealing with similarities between EU institutions and Swiss government. I think there are also many similarities to German system of government. For example, the role of the Council is similar to German Bundesrat and the system of exclusive competence and shared competence between member states and the EU is similar to competences between federal and Länder level in Germany. The Bundesrat has annually rotating presidency and it's composed of representatives of the Land governments, etc. Should somebody write something about this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.195.99.38 (talk) 22:23, 17 February 2008 (UTC)