Template talk:Infobox SSR

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Eesti Nõukogude Sotsialistlik Vabariik {{{{{Lang-ISO}}} icon}} Estonian Soviet Socialist Republic
Flag Coat of arms
Capital	Tallinn
Official language	None. De facto, Estonian and Russian.
Established In the USSR:  - Since  - Until	July 21, 1940 August 6, 1940 August 20, 1991
Area  - Total  - Water (%)	Ranked 13th in the USSR 45,226 km² 4.56%
Population  - Total   - Density	Ranked 15th in the USSR 1,565,662 (1989) 31.6/km²
Time zone	UTC + 3
Medals	None

Here's an example of a SSR infobox:

{{Template:Infobox SSR
| name = Estonian SSR
| full-name = Estonian Soviet Socialist Republic
| loc-name = Eesti Nõukogude<br>Sotsialistlik Vabariik
| flag = Flag of Estonian SSR.svg
| arms = COA Estonian SSR.png
| motto = '''[[Estonian language|Estonian]]:''' Kõigi maade proletaarlased, ühinege!
| map = SovietUnionEstonia.png
| capital = Tallinn
| language = None. De facto, [[Estonian language|Estonian]] and [[Russian language|Russian]].
| chairman = [[Arnold Rüütel]] (at independence)
| established = [[July 21]], [[1940]]
| ussr-start = [[August 6]], [[1940]]
| ussr-end = [[August 20]], [[1991]]
| area-rank = 13th
| area = 45,226
| water = 4.56%
| pop-rank = 15th
| pop = 1,565,662 ([[1989]])
| density = 31.6
| currency = [[Soviet ruble|Ruble]] (''rubla'')
| time-zone = + 3
}}

[edit] Issues with the infobox

This infobox seems to be modelled too much after Template:Infobox country, which is for contemporary and independent countries. Here are some suggestions.

• The language field. None of the SSRs apparently had an official language, so the box is redundant.
• The chairman field. For modern countries, an analogous field is used for the current head of state. Here it is being used to list the last chairman (i.e in 1991), which is not a good idea, because Perestroika-era leaders are generally not characteristic of the period. Listing all leaders throughout the SSR's existance is obviously not feasible. So this field should definitely be removed, and leaders listed in the article.
• A field could be added for the post-1991 independent country corresponding to the SSR and linking to the country article.

Rain74 14:48, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

In creating this template, I used mostly what was already at the SSR articles, and I think that's a good model. For language, Georgia had an official language, and I think it's useful to know which were the main languages spoken in an SSR for the rest. As for the chairman, I think it is useful to know the last one, and it helps to be analogous to the other articles. To remove that would be to remove potentially useful information and probably put it nowhere. Also, they are generally the only chairman with an article for most of these. The corresponding post-independence country would be useful, except for the fact that it is in the lede sentence of every applicable SSR article contains a link to the current corresponding country. Are there any other problems? LittleDan^talk 03:36, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for replying! My main problem was with the chairman field, and I still think it should be removed. I don't think it's right to prominently list only the last person in that position, especially as many of those listed contributed as much to the dissolution of the USSR as to ruling it (take Yeltsin for RSFSR, for example). No information has to be lost, there should be a list of all chairmen further down in the article. The fact that other chairman lack articles is not convincing, as they are notable people and should have articles made about them, the presence of redlinks in this article would only make it more likely to happen.

Rain74 08:35, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

I recently made some modifications to this infobox, incorporating some features of {{Infobox Former Country}}, which we are developing as part of WikiProject Former countries, to make the SSR infobox indicate clearly that it is a non-existing state and (as discussed above) allow for easy linking to the preceding and succeeding versions of the state discussed. An example of its use is at Armenia SSR, but the chanes have been temporarily removed. For those involved in the creation of this infobox, what are your thoughts about these additions? - 52 Pickup 12:38, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Red color

I have received some complaints about the red color used on this template. It was inspired by French Wikipedia and seemed to be a better alternative to the older, more drab SSR templates. Should we get rid of the color in favor of something else? Any comments, suggestions? -- Clevelander 16:28, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Maybe just a different shade of red? The bright red is a little garish, but the pale blue is just wrong. - 52 Pickup 17:40, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

I changed it to a darker shade of red (more crimson-like). Is that better? -- Clevelander 17:48, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Yes. Very nice. - 52 Pickup 17:52, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Slightly better, can we modify the text to look like the ones used on the US States?--MarshallBagramyan 21:01, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Sure. -- Clevelander 01:31, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Russian first

Because the Russian language was the de facto language of the Soviet Union, the Russian language is placed before the local language. This is good for the major language and for the fact that some states had more then one language. — NuclearVacuum 21:54, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

Russian might be the de facto language of the USSR, but it was not the de jure of the republics (and in most of them, neither it was de facto) --Explendido Rocha (talk) 00:29, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

The Russian language may not have been the de jure language of all the republics, but is was an official language of the USSR. And under the Soviet constitution, the Russian language is the de facto, witch means that this language has authority over all others. This goes also for the United States, having English over other languages, but also not making English it's only language. Excuse me for going off the subject, but this is the only example I could think of. It wasn't until the end of the USSR that the shortening of the Russian language took place in the non-Russian republics. Otherwise, Russian was most spoken, understood, and used during the Cold War (witch this article is only telling facts of the country during this time period). — NuclearVacuum 01:15, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

In first place, the Soviet Constitution didn't mention any official language. Russian was indeed the official language de facto _of the Union_. Not of the republics. Since the infobox refers to the republics rather to the union, the official language of each republic should be used. Otherwise, for you to be coherent, and since German is the most spoken, understood, and used language of Switzerland, I expect you to start downgrading the French and Italian names of the Swiss French- and Italian-speaking cantons and cities in their respective articles. --Explendido Rocha (talk) 19:48, 25 April 2008 (UTC)