Talk:History of the Turkish people
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[edit] Comments
[edit] copyright violation
The first three paragraphs, at a minimum, appear to be cut and pasted from here. If it cannot be shown very quickly that this is not a copyright violation, this text must be removed. --Kbh3rdtalk 14:19, 7 April 2006 (UTC)
what is wrong with it?
[edit] It is wrong
7th century BC is a wrong date for the first appereance of the Turkish tribes. At least 40 centuries of Turkish history is known today(actually ancestors of the first Turkish tribes possibly lived 10,000 years before). With respect, Deliogul 10:21, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
- The author says that the Turks first appeared in HISTORY (that is, in written sources) in the 7th century BC. It does not say this is the first moment the Turks appeared, but the first moment they appeared in history.DaMatriX 23:07, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
- As far as I know, it is 2nd century BC that Turkish people appear as a part of Hun coalition under Teoman. But Turkic people has an older history. Ati7 10:15, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
This article has factual frauds and is not supported by mainstream literature. The history of the Turkish people starts with the migration of the Seljuqs into Anatolia and, ultimately, with the rise of the Anatolian Turkmen Beyliqs who are the real origin of the modern Turkish people. This article does not differenciate between the Turkic peoples and the Turkish people. Modern Turks are mostly descendants of early Anatolians and converted Europeans who at some point in history adopted the language of the Turkish rulers. That's why their physical appearance is identical to neighbouring peoples, such as Persians or Greeks, who are not of East Asian or Mongoloid origin. The early Turks had Mongoloid features and were culturally and linguistically related to the later Mongols. The Turkic peoples of Central Asia who had lesser interactions with Non-Turks (for example the Yakut people or the Altay people) still reflect the ethnic Turkish origin. Like so many other Iranian, Greek, Arab, and Turkish articles in Wikipedia, this article, too, has a strong nationalist bias. It does not mention the real history of a people, but the history these people claim for themselvs. The truth is that all people in the Middle East - whether Persian, Kurd, Afghan, Turk, or Greek - share more or less a common origin which was neither Turkish, nor Persian, nor Greek. In the course of history, these people were conquered by small numbers of mostly nomadic invaders: first Semetic tribes, later Indo-Europeans, and then Turks. The number of these invaders was too small to change the genetical pool, but they were - in various degrees - able to force their language and/or identity on these people. It's called "elite dominance" in literature, and this process of "elite dominance" is the origin of Indo-European languages and Turkic languages in the Middle East. The concept of "Turkishness" was propagated in the early 19th century and was aimed to create some kind of "Turkish ethnic identity", something that had not existed in Anatolia before. Ottoman Anatolia was a mosaic of ethnic minorities of whom the large majority was non-Turkish. "Turk" was a mark of pride claimed by the Ottoman rulers who saw themselvs as descendants and successors of early Turkic ghazis. The word "Turk"' was established as a self-designation of the population of Anatolia much later. Thus, it is wrong to equate these people with the historical, nomadic tribes of Central Asia known as "Turks". This same mistake was corrected in Afghanistan-related articles, where nationalist Afghans claimed that "Afghanistan has 5000 years of history" and that all kinds of Islamic heroes and personalities were "Afghans": The truth is, that prior to the 20th century, only a few people in Afghanistan identified themselvs as "Afghans". Like in Turkey, the name was propagated by the Pashtun-dominated government and was aimed to eliminate the ethnic identity of other tribes ("Afghan" is actually another word for "Pashtun"). Turkish and Afghan politics of the early 20th century had the same source, and elite politicians from both countries - most notably Mahmud Tarzi - followed the same policies. Those who refused to submitt to the new nationalist policies of one single tribe were hunted down and were brandmarked as "traitors" and "enemies": in Turkey, it was the Armenians and Kurds. In Afghanistan, it was the Hazara and the Shia population in general. 82.83.158.97 12:20, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
