Talk:German Mediatisation

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My first article. :) The list of Bishops and Abbacies is not complete.

[edit] Proposed merger with Reichsdeputationshauptschluss

• Support. Although mediatisation may refer to the annexation/subordination of territories in general, and acts of mediatisation occurred both before and after the Napoleonic era, the term is used primarily in modern European history to refer to mediatisations which occurred toward the end of the 18th and beginning of the 19th centuries, and which were associated with the termination of the Holy Roman Empire. Moreover, the German Mediatisation article focuses mostly on that period. The 1803 Reichsdeputationshauptschluss was one of the major legal instruments that effected the mediatisations of that era. Therefore it should be integrated into the German Mediatisation article.Lethiere 22:13, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

Have now done the merge.--Boson 21:59, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hesse-Cassel and Frankfurt

Hesse-Cassel is listed among the mediatised monarchies, and Frankfurt among the mediatised free cities. But these states were not mediatised in the Reichsdeputationshauptschluss. They remained independent until seized by Prussia following the war of 1866. (Hannover, and Nassau, which also remained independent until they were seized by Prussia in 1866, are not listed on the page). I shall remove Hesse-Cassel and Frankfurt from the lists unless someone can explain why they are there.

Hesse-Homburg is also listed. This case is less clear. Hesse-Homburg was indeed mediatised, by Hesse-Darmstadt, in 1806, but became independent again in 1815, and remained so until its ruling house died out in 1866, when it once more became part of Hesse-Darmstadt. Maproom (talk) 16:11, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Both the Hesse states and Frankfurt have unique situations. I'll start with Hesse. Hesse-Homburg was a minor branch of the Hesse-Cassel line which was given certain rights though not the all important seat and vote in a Circle or the Imperial Diet. Hesse-Darmstadt never recognised the rights given to Hesse-Homburg and so they siezed it in 1806 with all of the other mediatisations going on. The Congress of Vienna restored Hesse-Homburg and gave it full independence in 1815. It is iffy if it should be on the list or not since it, unlike all the other states listed on the page, was not a Circle or Diet member. Hesse-Cassel on the other hand was not mediatised in 1806. But the Electors opposed Napoleon and in 1807 it was mediatised to the Kingdom of Westphalia, forming the core of the new kingdom. Hesse-Cassel was restored after the fall of Napoleon. All of the Imperial Free Cities were mediatised in the end. Frankfurt was in 1806, forming the centre of the Grand Duchy of Frankfurt. The Hanse cities of Hamburg, Bremen and Lubeck were annexed to France in 1810. These cities were restored independence by the Congress of Vienna because of their importance. The other two cities which survived the Reichsdeputationshauptschluss, Augsburg and Regensburg, were not restored. - Nomadic1 (talk) 22:12, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for this excellent explanation. I am convinced. Maproom (talk) 10:42, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

If you feel like editing the page though, you could make a style change and replace the flags on the Hesse line with a Coat of Arms like the other entries. - Nomadic1 (talk) 22:30, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

I've done that. I have also added coats of arms for Thorn, Schlitz, and (Werden-)Helmstedt, taken from their pages. Maproom (talk) 21:49, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

I've added a couple more Coats of Arms, Westphalia and Limburg-Styrum, made by taking the images on their pages and trimming them until I just have the escutcheon. Not too good, as I started with unsaturated and textured images. Some other mediatised states which already have Coats of Arms on this page, but with helms, supporters etc., are Muhlhausen, Nordhausen, Überlingen, and Hildesheim. I feel inclined to make new version with just the escutcheon (shield). These will be easier to trim, as the existing images are nice saturated ones. Do people feel it would be helpful to make and use tidy supporter-free versions of these escutcheons? Maproom (talk) 23:24, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Yep. - Nomadic1 (talk) 05:12, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Done. I wonder if there exists a computer program that accepts a blazon, and creates an image from it? I haven't been able to find one, which surprises me. Maproom (talk) 00:21, 14 January 2008 (UTC)