Talk:Genie

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I am writing a paper on language acquisition. I am very interested in the case of Genie and Victor. I would apriciate if somebody helped me. Do you know any really good sources where I can find some useful information?Thank you. E-mail me, please at irusia111@hotmail.com. Irina

What are contemporary Islamic views on the jinn? I am interested in this idea that the prophet was sent to men and jinn, presumably this puts them on a par with humans in that they are capable of religion. Where are the jinn supposed to reside? — Trilobite (Talk) 22:47, 16 Nov 2004 (UTC)

I am going to attempt to add a little bit about Islam and jnn because to them they are not merely myths. -gren

Contents

[edit] Etymology

In the article it associates "genie" with the arabic term "jinni", but I had always thought that the term "genie" had come into the language from "genius loci", and thus has a latinate origin. Can somebody vaidate the etymology? --138.163.0.43 (talk) 18:23, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] three wishes

where did the whole three wishes thing come from? - Omegatron 05:10, Dec 13, 2004 (UTC)

   I believe the three wishes thing came from the story of Aladdin

I don't recall in the original Aladdin the number of wishes actually being limited. --138.163.0.43 (talk) 18:23, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I edited this a bit. I wish there was better sourcing on 'Jinn in the Occult'; how much of this is genuine tradition and how much is derived from fantasy books? A clearer line should be drawn between the understandings of jinn in pre-Islamic Arabian mythology and Islam. How widespread was the belief in jinn before Islam; was it actually widespread among the Semitic peoples, or just limited to Arabs? Also, perhaps someone could improve this article by gleaning some things from the Farsi version.--Pharos 05:28, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

    Yeah, I would love to know what these "sorcery books" are supposed to be

[edit] Sources:

I can cite various sources about the Occoult and Muslim mythology, problem is that when it comes to Occoult books they're usually 50 pages of spells and rituals, many of the ones I read are in Arabic and other foreign lanuages.(burn this kind of inscence on a certain date and time, summon....... or the king of the tribe, his name is:...., say I command you in the name of:... Usually a higher spirit (the king of the tribe or an Angel) to do such and such) A source about Jinn and Kareens for example is: [1] It's in Arabic, yet if you can read or translate it it would confirm the edits. --The Brain 11:39, May 4, 2005 (UTC)

jinns where created for the same reason as human kind, to worship Allah and to establish his sovereignity upon the universe and in the hearts of the creations.

human kind were fashioned from clay and jinns were fashioned from smokeless fire. look through heat emanating from a hot object. the ripples created from this heat is similar to the body of a jinn. a little like the predator of the same film!

however jinns can change their form as they wish into any animate or inanimate object.

they have families who they care for, goals and aspirations, morals, ethics etc much the same as human kind.

there are those who are believers and there are those who are not.

because of their supernatural powers they can create a lot of mischief in our realm. there are those jinns who are classed as devils or demons who assist the main devil iblees (who is also a jinn) in creating evil upon the earth.

from what i understand, the realm of jinns is almost like a parralel dimension existing side by side on this earth. the jinns have the power to cross over into our dimension. however, they do not cross over into our dimension as often as they would like. this could be due to the jinns not understanding modern life and various advancements in technology and machinery etc and being afraid of it. a bit like a yokel coming into the big city. they have not been created with the brain power and tecnological drive possesed by human kind and only understand the ways of old.

there are many excorsists through out the world both charlatans and genuine. a visit to your local area mosque will point you in the right direction if you care to meet an excorcist and observe him at work. maybe get to see a jinn in the process. however, this can be very dangerous if the excorcist is not genuine so be careful. generally a charlaton demands a fee but a genuine excorcist will heal for three, but this is not always the case.

the above is the view of mainstream muslims. there may be variations in other sects.

if you have any questions please ask.



^Full Metal Alchemist? --Kashcubed 23:12, 18 April 2007 (UTC)


- I ve uploaded this picture, but somebody (from indonesia) ve been deleted it. This picture is a sample of the Real Jinn, and still alive in Indonesia.

Image:South_Queen_Genie.jpg

This Jinn was a myth in Indonesia. Until now. This Jinn is a kind of Water Species [Marid which isolate themselves to areas of water but are not of the plane of water as in the western role playing games {D&D}]. The name was "South Queen Genie" (Jinn Ratu Kidul). Live under the sea. --- signatured by : Prince eck 17:07, 27 March 2007 (UTC) , Indonesia.

[edit] Jinn in Islam

Can someone please remove the writing where it says that jinns are mythological creatures. There is no scientific backing to this claim, even if science cannot prove the existence of the jinn. Can it be just said that jinns are accepted by Islam to exist and nothing more. To see what I mean type in jinn in the wikipedia search box and scroll down to the bottom.


The claim that Jinnn were on earth before man and all the deletions is not supported by the Qur'an. There is one verse where the Angels object to man's dominance over Earth and exclaim to God:"Would you put on Earth those who would spill blood and we worship you and exhalt you?" So there is NO identification as to who was on Earth before man, also some scholars have explained this verse as the Angels questioning the free-will man posesses that might result in bloodshed. Shape-shifting and Starwars and all that is not at all mentioned in the Qur'an. Many Hadiths are of questionable authenticity. Farmers forged teachings (Hadiths) as marketing slogans claiming that they're natural cures for example. Many cultures forged Hadiths to suit their tradition. Finally, the test of the authenticity of a Hadith is whether or not it agrees with the teachings of the Qur'an (see fourth paragraph of Isnad"does the reported tradition agree with the Qur'an?". Moreover, I'm unaware of any Hadiths supporting the claims mentioned. --The Brain 15:29, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Although the Qur'an does not explicitly state that the Jinn came first, we can deduce as much from the text. The Qur'an says (38:72):

To the angels: "I am about to create man from clay:

When I have finished him... Fall ye down in obeisance Unto him.

later it goes on

(Iblis) was haughty, and became one of those who reject Faith.


Because it states that Iblis is a Jinn, it is obvious that the Jinn race came first. Iblis was made from smokeless fire (38:76), and not an angel (who cannot revolt, as it has no freedom of choice). If it would be possible to bring about the comparision between Christian and Muslim exorcism in a section or atleast demons and jinn.

I wonder if someone would be able to add something about الجن و البن that could be added to the article if it's not too trivial. The only page I could find with Google [2] doesn't seem to be cached properly. Beyond being able to recognize the letters and having a dictionary, I'd be of no real help with the page even if I could get it to come up right. Esquizombi 03:32, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Etymology

I corrected the etymology of Genie, which is not an Anglicization. For source, please refer to the The Harnhart Concise Dictionary of Etymology by Robert K. Barnhart, 1995.

Given the description of the connotations of the original Arabic term, does anybody think it more closely relates to "phantom" rather than "ghost"?

Will someone please add the meaning of the Arabic word Jin as a juxtaposition to the latin?82.6.114.172 21:49, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] E=mc²

A mere coincidence? madyasiwi 12:01, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

(I don't understand this section? I am aware of the E%3Dmc%C2%B2 law of converting matter into energy. I know about photons and ligh, but I don't understand what you are trying to deduce. Please clarify.)

  • Humans ~ clay ~ spirit ~ elements when become mortal means exclude from heaven. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.27.146.254 (talk) 13:52, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Where is Science?

Hi guys, I'd like to request an addition for a scientific explination (if possible) for Jinn issue. Despite this matter might look a myth to many, still there are few things that need to be explained about Jinn, for instance I happened to read, hear, and watch a show about curing people got possesed by Jinn, I also downloaded some video clips, you might find some if you google aroung. AshrafSS 08:58, 24 April 2006 (UTC)



I did hear once from someone that there are suggestions of some kind of movement detected in some other visual frequency... I haven't got any references on this but going to look this up at some point.

[edit] Alien/UFOs are really Jinns?

I know I'm not the only person whos been speculating this phenomenon from the very begining. But in every culture, there is always some kind of beleif of a strange mythical creatures that existed and have interacted with humans. Nowadays, a these creatures are often seen as ETs, and Aliens from other planets.

But Islam is the only religion (to my knowlege) that acknoleges the existence of an unseen beings that exist with us and have interacted with humans before. Incedently, would Jinns actually be the "Aliens" or "ETs" that everyone has been "seeing"?

"But Islam is the only religion (to my knowlege) that acknoleges the existence of an unseen beings that exist with us and have interacted with humans before." I suggest you read more comparative religion and mythology then. Jinn are directly analogous to the Medieval Western European concept of Faeries, creatures which were much more powerful in earlier stories than the prancing little sprites we think of them today. Also, most mythologies include secret races, such as the Native Hawaiians' Menehunes and the dryads of Roman myth. In short, the Jinn's place in the mythos is far from unique, and as far as the extraterrestial angle, the falls more in conspiracy than anything.--Primalchaos 16:48, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Inconsistent External Sources

The external link of: A Jinn Paralyses Me At Night, is inconsistent with article because the answer mentioned in the website is scientifically wrong. Such symptoms lead to the recently discovered phenomenon known as Sleep Paralysis, and not demonic possession as many peoples have thought over the centuries. Don't you think that link should be removed?-- Haisook 22:20, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

I believe the link was meant to illustrate the belief in such creatures extending into the modern day, not to illustrate any veracity to the claim. Some notation in that regard might be appropriate.--Primalchaos 23:39, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removed occult section

I removed the Occult section because the text is unclear to what it is referring. It mentions "the occult" and "sorcery" as if they were specific things rather than general categories. I have saved it here in case someone can categorize this information more specifically than "occult". If you can, please include a reference.

Andy 02:53, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
Jinn in the Occult
In sorcery books Jinn are classified into four races after the classical elements, Earth, Air, Fire (Ifrit) and Water (Marid) and presumed to live in them. They are collected in tribes, usually seven, each with a king. Each king controls his tribe and is controlled by an Angel. The Angel's name is torture to the jinn king as well as his specific tribe.
Unlike white and evil witches, Jinn have free will; yet, they could be compelled to perform both good and evil acts. In contrast a demon would only hurt creatures, and an angel would only have benevolent intentions. Knowing what to ask a spirit to perform is key, as asking a spirit to perform a chore that runs counter to its natural tendencies could possibly anger the spirit into retaliating against the sorcerer.
I removed the label saying this is based on Dungeons and Dragons, it does not correpsond to the game at all.--64.230.84.131 09:10, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Alien/UFOs are really Jinns? (2)

Check this: [[3]]

None of this constitutes encyclopedic material.--Primalchaos 00:37, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mythical?

How is it, that the sections for Unicorns, Wyvern, Dragons,Minotaur,Griffin and Phoenix are clearly states as 'mythical' or 'legends' in the opening of the article -- why does this article not adopt the same standard?

Because Djinn are still prominent figures in the Muslim religion, and are not considered mythical by its practicioners. For a similar standard, see the articles on demon or angel, which are closer in context.--Primalchaos 02:34, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
So basically dogma. interesting, yet scary. 71.96.101.186 dynamxi

[edit] Picture of 'Genie'

I thought this was a picture of the Anunnaki? Since when was it a genie? It comes from arabic mythology. Though I guess it could be referred to a genie if we look at the passage

Amongst archeologists dealing with ancient Middle Eastern cultures, any mythological spirit lesser than a god is often referred to as a "genie", especially when describing stone reliefs or other forms of art. This practice draws on the original meaning of the term genie for simply a spirit of any sort.

Even so the inclusion of this picture may be a little misleading...

65.97.14.167 21:45, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

The imagery is consistent with pre-Islamic depictions of the jinn, but if a suitable replacement could be found that wasn't overly Western, I'd be all for it.--Primal Chaos 19:05, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

== Free Choice, Not free will.

Free will is where one that wills something to happen, it happens. Only Allah in islam has free will or any will. In islam when Allah wills something, it happens. Man cannot will anything to happen. It is believed that humans have free choice, whether to follow him or not.

Correction: Free will is a choice because it refers to being unbound. As to Allah or God he is not bound to anything and has will over matter and can will things to be. He doesn't have to choose to be free because he is not bound.

[edit] The Truth

See people believe in ghost , phantoms , and other good and evil spirits but the truth is its all jinns. Of course in islam we have the belife that the soul can be unrested and boughthered by certain phenomenons but mainly what people believe to be ghosts are really jinns. Such places like huanted houses or towns are areas which are cursed by jinns who were there before any humans stepped foot on the land. If Muslims and non muslims want to know more info they should visit a local mosque or Masjid and find out more through a cleric , Shiekh , or a Scholar. Abdul916 18:43, 25 January 2007 (UTC)



the majority of Muslim scholars think that the whole issue of exorcism is a lie and its practiced by lairs taking advantage of the people tendency to blame their illness or failures on jinn or supernatural powers -exactly the same when someone claims that he has been abducted by a UFO-, Muslims believe that the jinn exist but they also believe that they live in their own world and that they cant interfere with our lives because humans (Muslims and non Muslims) are protected by god, we cant find a single narration that prophet Mohammad has ever mentioned exorcism or practiced it , (and as all Muslims know the source of Islam is the quran and prophet Mohammad talks ), also there is only a single verse in quran that might be thought of as mentioning jinn physical effect on human -in Arabic called MASS- but again the majority of Muslim scholars say its only a metaphor, and exorcism was never mentioned. so if the quran and prophet Mohammad whom all Muslims agree as the source of Islam, never mentioned or practiced exorcism ,then its not at all part of Islam . as for the jinn effect on humans the Muslims believe -as mentioned before- that satan is a jinn ,and satan tries to make humans do evil doings not by forcing them but by trying to make some evil and bad thoughts cross their minds . Again one of the bases of islam is that HUMANS HAVE FREE WELL, and they and only they choose to do bad or good and they are responsible for their choices nor the satan or jinn or anything else can force you to do bad or good. Putting it in another way, the quran called the HUMANS who temptate their fellow humans to act in a bad manner as SATANS. One last thing, I am a physician, and in a study made in Jordan by Jordanian psychiatrists it was proved that all the illnesses that patients attribute to jinn and go to exorcists for were caused by a psychiatric illness. awad 11,march , 2007


following is a Hadith that negates the above

I saw Allah's Messenger (sallallahu àlaihi wa sallam) do three things which no one before or after me saw. I went with him on a trip. On the way, we passed by a woman sitting at the roadside with a young boy. She called out, 'O Messenger of Allah, this boy is afflicted with a trial, and from him we have also been afflicted with a trial. I don't know how many times per day he is seized by fits.' He (sallallahu àlaihi wa sallam) said: 'Give him to me.' So she lifted him up to the Prophet.

He (sallallahu àlaihi wa sallam) then placed the boy between himself and the middle of the saddle, opened the boy's mouth and blew in it three times, saying, 'In the name of Allah, I am the slave of Allah, get out, enemy of Allah!' Then he gave the boy back to her and said: 'Meet us on our return at this same place and inform us how he has fared.' We then went. On our return, we found her in the same place with three sheep. When he said to her, 'How has your son fared?' She replied: 'By the One who sent you with the truth, we have not detected anything (unusual) in his behavior up to this time.... (Musnad Ahmad (vol: 4, p. 170), and al-Haakim, who declared it Saheeh)

[edit] Jonathan Stroud

I removed the following paragraph from the article. Someone might want to edit and re-add it. Tesseran 18:39, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Also the trilogy of book's by Jonathan Stroud Named the bartimeus trilogy which is based on the Arabic Dijini. These books are a story of jinn which are super natural called upon in pentacles by modern day magicians who run the country. The jinn in these story's are hard to control and if you get the encantation wrong then the jinn will destroy you. It saids in the book that the jinn come from another place entirely, a place of hazards and destruction. Only one magician was ever able to go to the place and come back alive-this was the Mgician from ancient Egypt a royal prince called Potolemy-but horribly misfigured. All the other magicians have gone their for their own greed and never came back to earth, the other one person who was ever sucsessful was commoner by the name of Kitty Jones.

[edit] Genie as a thief

Ref. are correct & online.Rana Ammar Mazhar 19:07, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Q (Star Trek)

Should Q (of Star Trek) be considered a god? a djinni? a bodhisattva? A super-villain of natural causes? A demon? Just wondering. — Rickyrab | Talk 15:33, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Questions about the Genie's relationship to the Roc

I'm reading the B&N Classics edition of Arabian Nights, and there's a particular passage in The Story of Aladdin that confuses me. I'm hoping someone could clarify...

Aladdin is tricked into believing that his palace would be even more beautiful if a Roc's egg were suspended from the ceiling of one of the palace's rooms. When he asks the Genie to acquire a Roc's egg and suspend it for him, the genie replies: "How, thou wretch! Is it not enough that I and my companions have done everything thou has chosen to command? Wouldst thou repay our services by such unparalleled ingratitude, as to command me to bring thee my master, and hang him up in the midst of this vaulted dome? For this crime thou dost deserve to be instantly torn to atoms, and thy wife and palace should perish with thee."

This seems to imply a very specific relationship between Rocs and Genies which I had never heard of before. Is this to be taken literally to mean that Rocs are the masters of Genies? Even if not, why is it that Genies hold such great respect for the Roc? Is there any other text that anyone knows of which explains this more?

(and by the way, the three-wishes restriction does not come from this story: Aladdin uses the genie on many many, many occasions - I haven't been counting, but three was easily passed before he even began pretending to be a prince.) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.5.63.11 (talk) 15:55, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 'Jinn' is a better name than 'Genie'

'Genie' is IMO a dumb name, it should be 'Jinn' in english —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.162.213.64 (talk) 02:07, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, I think the term 'jinn' cognates with 'creature of fire' (since that jinn are made of fire). the term 'creature of fire' is used in a Hollywood movie where a American man travels all the way to Africa to find Solomon's book with a British woman archeologist - it was in Solomon's book that the 'creature of fire' was mentioned and I'm certain that it's referring to the jinn - since that Prophet Solomon had been dealing with jinns according to Islam. I've forgotten the title of the movie - can someone please tell me what it is? --121.217.106.158 (talk) 03:50, 10 December 2007 (UTC)



[edit] Xian?

How exactly does the Chinese "Xian" figure into the Genie issue? Xian are /people/, not spirits, who become immortal via Taoist practise. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.240.20.247 (talk) 20:22, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Shaitan?

The article says that Shaitan is a class of djinn, but the hyperlink states that Shaitan is equivalent to the Christian Satan. Which is it? Ashmoo (talk) 10:42, 14 April 2008 (UTC)