Talk:Freeze (exhibition)

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[edit] Verification

Stephen Park and Steven Adamson need to be verified as having been inlcuded in the show. Tyrenius 21:30, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Park is mentioned in a Tate essay as part of the YBA crowd.[1] Tyrenius 21:34, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Stephen Park and Steve Adamson were definately in the show. I saw it, I have the catalogue and they are both listed. Admittedly Dominic Denis is also listed but he wasn't in the show. If I remember correctly Damien didn't think his work fitted in.

Some things you may not know about Freeze, that I can't verify, but I know because I was there.
Please verify whatever you can.

Prior to Freeze, Damien was working for a few weeks at the blue-chip gallery Anthony D'offays. He told me that he stole the mailing list, which contained the names and addresses of the wealthiest and most serious art collectors in Europe and America. He produced a catalogue to look like the catalogues these collectors were familiar with, designed by a familiar designer, photographs by a familiar photographer. Everyone on the mailing list recieved a catalogue, sent to them in the post gratis. When these collectors started sniffing around the show (which was not until the second part, Freeze was in two parts) the fashionable dealers from London naturally felt they might be left out of the party, they had to make their moves. This was an interesting spectacle, and for a couple of weeks there was a lot of nervous indecision. I think Damien had called their bluffs. Remember Damien was a second year student!

Damiens criteria for inclusion in the show, (the original intention was that curating it was to be a collective endevour, but Damien very quickly took unilateral decisions, and he was doing all the work):

Artists who already had galleries, or had sold work to gallerists, or had serious interest from galleries were invited, i.e. Ian Davenport (Waddington), Gary hume (Karsten Schubert). Fiona Rae had sold a painting to Karsten Schubert. Other artist may have already had links with Galleries. Galerists did not particularly support their artist taking part in this show. I believe i am right in thinking Grenville Davey was instructed not to take part by Nicholas Logsdale of the Lisson Gallery.

Friends of Damien were invited. I. e. Angus Fairhurst, Matt Collishaw, Angela Bulloch ( Damiens girlfriend at the time)

Artist who had enjoyed a good reputation at goldsmiths college were also invited.

There was obviously some crossover between these three groups. It is interesting to see which artists have risen to prominence.

Goldsmiths already enjoyed attention from galleries at this time in the wake of the success of Julian Opie and Lisa Milroy.

Thepeopleschum 11:49, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] A quibble, or is it just me?

"Furthermore, some of the artists in Freeze did not make it into the pantheon of the YBAs." this is a bit problematic. Surely anyone who is Young, and british, and an artist is by definition a Young British Artist. (though I know it also means something more specific, though what is quite hard to characterize). To say that any artist, who by default is young and british, didn't make it as one, is awkward. I think what you meant was "didn't make it into the commercial artworld". The problem with this is that it might be taken to imply that "making it" was a primary ambition. In my experience this presumption becomes irrititating to artists of all kinds even when accurate, though it is often isn't. Thepeopleschum 16:49, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

I've changed wording re pantheon. Young British Arists was the title Saatchi used for shows, as you may know, so it has a specific meaning for a group of artists, and others who became associated with them, so we're talking about the Young British Artists, not young British artists, as there were plenty of the latter not counted as the former. Please add to the article anything you think will improve it. Tyrenius 00:34, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "Pantheon?"

Thanks for removing "make it". I wonder if "pantheon" is not somewhat overblown. It may be that its just not a word I am quick to use. I take its loosest definintion to mean "hall of fame". I recognise the impact of the show and the personal success stories that sprang from it, but I don't really see many names that can be said to have entered any kind of pantheon; Damien Hirst notwithstanding. Would you object if I changed the sentence to read, "Furthermore, some of the artists in Freeze are yet to appear on the international art scene"  ?. RegardsThepeopleschum 09:58, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

I suggest you plough into the article and do with it what you will, adding any info you think suitable. It can always be re-edited if anyone disagrees. See WP:BRD. I'd like to see some of the unique insights that I think you can include. If they're not challenged, then they remain. However, as you asked re "Furthermore, some of the artists in Freeze are yet to appear on the international art scene", the wording implies that they will do one day, whereas this is not necessarily the case at all, so maybe something like: "Furthermore, some of the artists in Freeze did not receive the same attention as others on the international art scene". Tyrenius 01:58, 22 February 2007 (UTC)