Talk:Frasier Crane

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[edit] No references

This article doesn't cite a single reference. If I submit it for deletion on that basis, what particular brand of cognitive dissonance would you use to argue for keeping it? Rogerborg 10:27, 1 December 2007 (UTC)


Was it really Boston, New York, and not Boston, Massachusetts? -- Oliver P. 21:40, 18 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Must be Boston, Massachusetts, where the Cheers bar is. --Wik 21:57, Aug 18, 2003 (UTC)


[edit] defirences

there are several ties where the stories dont stick. like frasiers age and how martin was shot.. its a long series (11seasons) with a number of writers, so basicly mistakes are bouned to happen —Preceding unsigned comment added by Topsecrete (talk • contribs) 18:37, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Early life, and life on Cheers

Much of the info given in this section is from the show "Frasier" not "Cheers". Much of this info was not known about Frasier on "Cheers". This whole section ought to be redone and it would be good to point out and show the differences in the character on "Cheers" as opposed to "Frasier" because he was a very different character on each. Frasier only became so pompous on his show, while on "Cheers", although he was a bit pompous and a bit of a fancy when he first appeared, he soon became one of the guys and would join in on sports discussions and regular guy stuff and could understand these things and not have to have it explained to him as he did on "Frasier".

[edit] Birthday

"One episode said that Frasier was born in 1952, while in another his birthday was said to be the same as one of Queen Elizabeth's children (none of whom were born in 1952)." These two facts are not mutually exclusive, although the way they are phrased in the article gives the impression that they are: it is commonplace to read in some newspapers filler columns telling readers names of famous people they share their birthday with. It's a case of birthday v birthdate and the second episode referenced above did not state that Frasier was born on the same date as any of Queen Elizabeth's children. Kenguest 06:20, September 5, 2005 (UTC)

For what it is worth, there are more references in the show tying down his birthdate to just about 1952. For instance, there is the episode where he gives up his place in the emergency room line and is falsely reported to have died. In the early part of the first season (set in 1993), there are references to his being 41. Etc. etc. It basically has to be 1952. -Peter

Current version reads that Frasier was born 10th March 1962. There is no way this is correct. 1952 is the year offered on numerous occasions, the character is in his early forties when the show begins in 1993, etc.-Peter

I went ahead and changed the birthdate to 1952. I'm not sure about the 10the March part, but 1962 is definitely wrong.


[edit] Job

Is Frasier a psychologist or a psychiatrist? Apparently the show (wrongly) uses the terms interchangably.

  • I guess he's both, since he directly helps people, but has a passion for the science as well. But, he's probably more of a psychiatrist. Jackpot Den 06:44, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
  • JackpotDen, the distinction has nothing to do with style or passion. A psychiatrist has been to medical school and is able to prescribe drugs, whereas a psychologist is someone who has studied the human mind. Frasier is a medical doctor, thus he is a psychiatrist.
As far as I know, one generally becomes a psychologist having completed pre-med, and if they wish to become a psychiatrist, finish medical school. You can't really be a psychiatrist without being a psychologist, it's like being a doctor but being unable to function as a nurse. Not all psychologists are therapists, like not all nurses are caregiver-practitioner-thingies.


All of the above explanations on the difference between psychiatry and psychology are partially or fully wrong. Both clinical psychologist and psychiatrist treat patients. A clinical psychologist has a Ph.D. (generally 4 years undergraduate 7 years graduate school) and a psychiatrist is an M.D. (4 years undergraduate, 4 years medical school, 3 years residency) or D.O. Clinical psychologists are trained in psychology departments and professional schools of psychology, while psychiatrist go to medical school and then complete a residency in psychiatry. Clinical psychologist treat patients through talk therapy, while psychiatrist generally use medications such as SSRI's. Psychiatrist can use talk therapy with specialized training but usually do not because it isn't as lucrative as simply prescribing. Ph.D. clinical psychologists can prescribe in a couple states with specialized training but generally use talk therapy. There is a discrepancy in the show because Frasier talks about going to medical school but also discusses getting a Ph.D. (which he would not get at a medical school). Based on how Frasier and his brother Niles treat and assess their patients it is much more likely that they are Ph.D. clinical psychologists than psychiatrist as psychiatrist. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.162.74.128 (talk) 04:12, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Money

Fictionally speaking, just how rich IS Frasier? He seems to throw money away left and right. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.122.208.51 (talk) 18:48, 18 January 2007 (UTC).

He would have to be pretty rich. The furniture he owns is worth thousands and thousands (for instance, the Eames lounge chair and Ottoman situated by his balcony would alone be $3-4k; most of the furniture would be several grand at a minimum (even that atrocity of a chair his dad owned must have cost at least $3-4k to custom remake in the episode "Blaze-e-boy")), the painting behind his piano looks like something like a Rauschenberg (and as such would probably fetch minimum $20k), the green glass sculpture by his fireplace is very obviously a Chihuly (again, probably something in the neighborhood of $20k). He dresses in very expensive suits, wears expensive shoes, dines regularly at top-drawer places, etc. He inhales foie gras and other expensive delicacies. He drives the Beamer and, in Seattle, an apartment like that would be *well* into seven figures. As a wine collector, I'd also like to add that he and Niles drink extremely expensive stuff (he has mentioned drinking top drawer wines like Gaja; in Lillith Thanksgiving Niles mentions that they were to drink a "case of Montrachet" over a Thanksgiving outing, which would probably be a minimum of $300 and could easily reach $3000 or more; Dom Perignon champagne, which he drinks like water, is $100 a pop or more, depending on the year; etc.). I would think that, when incidental expenses and all else are factored in, he would have to be pulling in *minimum* $400-500k per year to make it all work comfortably (and probably more than that). Note, however, that Frasier lives like a monk compared with Niles. -Peter, February 27, 2007.

It's unrealistic. He doesn't come from "old money" - his dad is very working class - and realistically he's more of an upper middle class professional who lives very well but still has to work for a living. I can't imagine he makes more than $250,000 a year as his show is local. Niles was married to a very wealthy heiress. - MF

Oh, yeah, I couldn't agree more: it is completely unrealistic. There's no way he could make it work. He is ballpark at least $250k per year short salary-wise. Frankly, even Roz is unrealistic: she lives much more modestly than Frasier, but still well beyond the means of someone in her position. -Peter, May 23, 2007

  • actualy concidering the fact that he is sendicated and that he does promos. that would get him lots of money. and also how many did bebe get him a huge raise. not to mention more than 10 years as a doctor.. also same goes for roz...so to a certain extint it is believable

I disagree: he has a small, local AM show, and even in a market like Seattle that does not make you $400k. And when he syndicated, it was to Spokane. People like Roz typically make very little in real life. -Peter, October 5, 2007

[edit] Languages

The article lists that Frasier can speak German. Couldn't he have spoken directly to the fencing instructor during the fight with Niles instead of interpreting via Marta? Or have I mis-remembered that episode? --Billpg 21:39, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

I think this one can be chalked down to a continuity error on part of the program makers - in the episode you identify he can't speak German, but I think it's established in later episodes that he can (I think one of his plans is to do a translation of Freud or something). Can't remember which specific episode, though. --Joseph Q Publique 01:36, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

-One episode where I am pretty sure he speaks German comes in season eight, episode "Semi-Decent Proposal/A Passing Fancy" when he converses in German with someone in an electronics store line-Peter 9/2/06

Just for the sake of those who like to keep things "in canon" in their heads, I don't think the two episodes contradict each other. When someone asks me, "Do you speak French?" my answer is no, but then they're amazed when I can speak some French and also read it. And yet I still don't consider myself to "speak French". Most likely, in the "Frasier" universe, Frasier was being modest/conservative about his abilities when he said he didn't speak German, and he quite probably meant he didn't speak it conversationally, which is much, much harder than merely being able to read and write in it, thus his ability to attempt a translation of Freud. wikipediatrix 00:19, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Spam Abuse

A spammer named Fraser Cain has created this link. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraser_Cain

Here is his only legitimate page. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universe_Today

I recommend this person be banned. A small ezine publisher masquerading as a TV celeb to try and steal extra hits to his website has to be a breach of the Wikipedia guidelines. At the very least it smacks of contempt for our intelligence or total disregard for netiquette. I also recommend that this section be deleted after action has been taken to rectify the matter. No need to give the little Troll any more attention. Here is how I discovered the vandalism. He was boasting about it at his site. http://www.bautforum.com/showthread.php?t=41740 UniverseToday 01:00, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Please see Wikipedia:Requests_for_investigation#New_requests for record of User:UniverseToday's activity. - Reaverdrop (talk/nl/wp:space) 03:36, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] A reply to the previous

How can you seriously consider an entry for a real living person in his real actual name, to be spam and "masquerading as a TV celeb" just because of the accidental similarity to the name of a fictional character in a TV show?

I consider your response to be in contempt of our intelligence since you apparently don't expect people to be able to distinguising the two spellings.

As for the claim of boasting, it was done with a lot of sockpuppets of UniverseToday who had earlier been banned from the board, which makes this look like a smearing campain by a disgruntles ex-user of the site in question.

I would like to apologise to fans of Frasier who inadvertently gets dragged into this dispute, this has nothing to do with you or Frasier and is only the result of UniverseToday's personal problems with a competing site. HenrikOlsen 12:00, 23 May 2006 (UTC)


Just to add another voice of support: Fraser Cain is a real person (I work with him) and a legitimate person to have in wikipedia. He is the publisher of Universe Today, a podcaster for the Astronomy Cast podcast, and works on the BAUTForum. He works with Phil Plait, who has a page. - StarStryder 23 Dec 2006

[edit] Cheers episodes

Someone needs to go over his Cheers appearances. (Metnever 14:49, 4 January 2007 (UTC))

[edit] MD/PhD?

Does Frasier have both? - MF

Both. For instance, he has written himself prescriptions in "Frasier Crane's day off" (indicating an MD) and there are indirect references to his PhD (eg "My son with his PhD mind" in the episode "Retirement is Murder") but Bebe makes it clear that he holds both in the episode "And the Whimper is". - Peter

[edit] Languages - once again

The article now states that Frasier speaks French, German, Italian, and Spanish. Is there any evidence of Frasier speaking German? In one episode, he does say Guten Tag, but being able to say Good day in a language is quite different from speaking it. In the fencing episode, his German is non-existant, not even able to pick up the error in Martha's translation that leads to the fight. As for French and Spanish, he speaks them both at times. Always with a very heave accent, but clearly speaking them. Italian is ok as well I guess, although I haven't heard him actually use it.JdeJ 22:11, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

In the episode "Semi-Decent Proposal" he appears to clearly speak German. -Peter

[edit] Winslow?

What the source for Frasier's middle name being "Winslow"? He is twice referred to on Cheers as "Frasier W. Crane", but I cannot find any instances of his middle name being spoken aloud on-air, or shown on-screen. 172.129.148.229 18:51, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Good question. There are a set of transcripts from the show `Frasier' online (at http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Derby/3267/) (I have found these to be pretty accurate) and a quick search of them reveals no evidence for his middle name being "Winslow". If it was introduced within an episode, I think it would have to have been on `Cheers' or, less likely, `Wings'. -Peter, June 19, 2007.

[edit] Character differences

Should there be a section highlighting the rather extreme difference between Frasier on Cheers and Frasier on Frasier? I mean it's pretty clear that the writers of the latter took the character off in a completely different direction, doesn't that merit a section? -MichiganCharms 13:32, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

While I think there should be such a section, I'm not sure I'd agree that the differences were that extreme. It was just a different phase of his life, and a different setting. David Hyde Pierce once described Niles as the Frasier who never went off to Boston. -Peter July 30, 2007

[edit] In-universe style

This article needs more out-of-universe context about the character. I won't add the {{TV-in-universe}} template, because I think that's a bit obnoxious, but I do think that the article is lacking in real-world information. For example, what Cheers episode did Frasier first appear in? (I don't think he was in the first season.) Were the changes in the character's personality between Cheers and Frasier deliberate? I'm sure that there are interviews with Kelsey Grammer or the shows' writers which could shed light on the character's development. I'm not a Cheers expert, and I leave the task in the hands of those who are. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 02:56, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:FrasierCrane1.jpg

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BetacommandBot 15:14, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Nature of time spent at Oxford

In 'The Harassed' (episode 228, season 10) Julia says to Frasier, 'you're a magic eight ball with a Harvard degree' and some time later, after the sexual harassment meeting, he retorts, 'I'm just a magic eight ball with a Harvard and Oxford degree.' If he was a postdoctoral research fellow at Oxford I wouldn't expect him to have taken a degree there. Obviously his PhD and MD are both Harvard degrees since these degrees at Oxford are called DPhil and DM and the DM is a higher doctorate rather than a professional qualification. I assumed that his Oxford degree was a second BA (which would eventually lead to an MA) or a one- or two-year master's degree such as the MSt, MSc, MLitt, or MPhil (or the corresponding postgraduate bachelor's degrees if he studied before they were converted to master's degrees). When is it specified that he was a postdoctoral research fellow and when was it specified that it was at Corpus Christi College?--Oxonian2006 (talk) 18:54, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

It does just now occur to me that perhaps as a postdoctoral research fellow he would have been a member of Congregation and thus would have had conferred upon him the degree of Master of Arts.--Oxonian2006 (talk) 00:29, 7 April 2008 (UTC)