Talk:Devasahayam Pillai

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Assessment comments The following comments were left by the assessors: (edit · refresh) this is category Z not B. pure false propaganda. The article deserves only 'Start' class due to the following reasons: The article violates NPOV by launching a vehement attack on Hinduism and Hindu upper castes. The article does not quote any RELIABLE references or sources. The reference provided is a controversial CBCI website. Just as there are people who feel that "Devasahayam, Pillai was a Christian martyr murdered by fanatical Hindus" there might also be alternative sources which might propagate the view that "Devasahayam was a criminal and an agent of the Dutch East India Company who deserved to be killed for seditition".It is upto us to balance these evenly and seperate the facts from fiction. The biographical article doesnt have an infobox. The article has too much "citation needed" tags, an image whose copyright is dubious (from a copyrighted book purchased by the user) and doesnt have enough information to rate it anything beyond a "start quality" article-Ravichandar84 08:54, 1 December 2007 (UTC)

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More information about this article... The following comments have been left for this page: this is category Z not B. pure false propaganda. The article deserves only 'Start' class due to the following reasons: The article violates NPOV by launching a vehement attack on Hinduism and Hindu upper castes. The article does not quote any RELIABLE references or sources. The reference provided is a controversial CBCI website. Just as there are people who feel that "Devasahayam, Pillai was a Christian martyr murdered by fanatical Hindus" there might also be alternative sources which might propagate the view that "Devasahayam was a criminal and an agent of the Dutch East India Company who deserved to be killed for seditition".It is upto us to balance these evenly and seperate the facts from fiction. The biographical article doesnt have an infobox. The article has too much "citation needed" tags, an image whose copyright is dubious (from a copyrighted book purchased by the user) and doesnt have enough information to rate it anything beyond a "start quality" article-Ravichandar84 08:54, 1 December 2007 (UTC) (edit)

its been contributed by an annonymous user on another page [1]. With some work it can be made an historical article. I recommend leaving it until someone comes along to clean it up, rather than deleting it. Btw it certainly isnt patent nonsense -- ^{PlaneMad|YakYak} 08:03, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

I agree, and I am deprodding for now. Thorough cleanup and investigation is needed, but a skim-through indicates that the page seeks to relate an incident in good faith. Let me work on it and see what it is about. ImpuMozhi 15:21, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] POV

I have noted that there are some sections in this article which are not neutral in language. Here are some examples:

later to be martyred by the high caste Hindus in the Kingdom

The Brahmins and the other high caste Hindus plotted to do away with Devasahayam Pillai, once and forever

Other phrases require proper citations to back up the "facts" being presented, such as:

On the advice of the Hindu high priests, the king and his Dewan agreed to his banishment

As was customary in those days, his body was painted with red and black spots, something reserved for very cruel criminals and was intentionally marched through populated areas, both as if it were a punishment to him and also to discourage future conversions among the high caste Hindus

De Lennoy’s Christian faith interested Devasahayam and De Lenoy enlightened him on the faith and that it was the answer to all of Devasahayam’s woes and family problems

The basis of the claims may indeed be true, but citations are a must in this case. I also sense a slightly anti-Hindu tilt in the article, as I have noted the relevant passages in bold, where non-neutral terms have been used, such as "martyr" and picturing the Brahmins as "plotting to do away with" Devasahayam Pillai. People may view Devasahayam as a "martyr", but if this is the case then it must be stated many/some view him as a martyr

This is the reason why I have placed a POV tag on this article, and it will remain there until these problems have been corrected. Kshatriya Grandmaster 10:37, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

I ma add that the name itself indicates that this fellow was a Shaiva vellala Pilla and not a Nair Pillai at all. The story is like all stories where every christian has to claim to descend from "High Caste" people. the truth is that 99% of the christians are descended from low caste people and the 1% are people who were banished from High caste. Whenever the talk of high caste omes in in a christian propaganda story be rest assured that it is all falsehood. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 196.1.52.48 (talk • contribs) 18:55, 2 May 2007.

I have indented the previous biography under the heading "Catholic account of his life", and added a section about the controversy over his beatification, with other points of view. Other editors and I have toned down or removed a lot of the previous POV language. I think the POV tag can now be removed, but I am proposing it here first hoping for prior consensus or further improvements. - Fayenatic (talk) 19:43, 1 December 2007 (UTC)