User talk:BlueSapphires

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[edit] Your note

Thanks, BS. I haven't edited that article for a long time, so it might be a good idea to leave it on that talk page. Cheers, SlimVirgin (talk) 09:18, 29 June 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Re: Amyphoto deletion discussion

All that is necessary is to identify the copyright holder. There is some speculation going on with regards to licensing, if Renner could confirm that the copyright is owned by the parents or by the school, or otherwise identify the copyright holder, the image will be kept. Why such a big fuss? Well, WP:NFCC#10 requires source information and attribution of the copyright holder. If you ask me, this criterion has been satisfied and then some. ˉˉanetode╦╩ 15:12, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Racking up the number of GFDL licensed stuff is pretty much what Wikipedia is all about. I agree that there are many images that no copyright holder would ever allow to be released under a free license and understand how this could be one of those cases. I'll gladly keep tabs on the IfD discussion, but any closure would have to be done by an uninvolved admin. Regards, ˉˉanetode╦╩ 15:35, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
The English Wikipedia is run by the Wikimedia Foundation, a non-profit from Florida founded by Jimmy Wales. The GFDL was chosen as the basic license since it allowed modification and redistribution (including commercial publication) of all material, provided that the license is maintained in derivative works and all contributors and prior revisions are attributed (hence the edit history). Other licenses, like some of the ones defined by Creative Commons, allow a greater degree of freedom, but for Wikipedia to use any of them, they must be free or functionally equal to the public domain. Your comparison to Corbis is apt: the WMF also runs Wikimedia Commons, a repository of free images that anyone can use. Essentially all us editors create content that you don't have to pay for, but that others can profit from. ˉˉanetode╦╩ 16:01, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
  • In answer to your inquiry on my talk page, write to the parents and ask if they own the picture and if they are willing to license the photo for any purpose, or if they give permission for publication only. You should be especially careful if they ask what the license entails. They should have an informed choice about derivative works etc. -Nard 15:53, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Email 1 from Ohio School Pictures

  • Email (with original headers) confirming that Ohio School Pictures is the photographer for Amy’s school. Email addresses have been edited to replace for the “@” with “–AT-“, and “-DOT-COM” with, “-DOT-COM”, so as to limit the spam-damage towards my gmail account, as well as to Ohio School Pictures. Headers have been included for reference validity purposes (to prove I didn't make up the conversation).

BlueSapphires 18:17, 7 August 2007 (UTC) Delivered-To: sapphires.blue-AT-gmail-DOT-COM Received: by 10.65.116.11 with SMTP id t11cs582311qbm;

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 07:56:39 -0700 (PDT)

Received: by 10.35.68.16 with SMTP id v16mr11798923pyk.1186498599126;

Tue, 07 Aug 2007 07:56:39 -0700 (PDT)

Return-Path: <customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM> Received: from mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM (mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM [66.94.95.35])

by mx.google-DOT-COM with ESMTP id n80si9190641pyh.2007.08.07.07.56.38;
Tue, 07 Aug 2007 07:56:39 -0700 (PDT)

Received-SPF: pass (google-DOT-COM: best guess record for domain of customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM designates 66.94.95.35 as permitted sender) Received: from CS01S [66.94.95.34] by mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM with ESMTP

(SMTPD-9.21) id A83C0140; Tue, 07 Aug 2007 10:57:00 -0400

From: "Customer Service" <customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM> To: "'Blue Sapphire'" <sapphires.blue-AT-gmail-DOT-COM> Subject: RE: School: Bay Middle School Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2007 10:56:38 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative;

boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001B_01C7D8E1.A10C0830"

X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3138 Thread-Index: AcfY9MV4qXunatexRgGVRhjTSg0vxwADlFFA In-Reply-To: <b4b3d680708070613h3b965ed4ya66ecb2df97f6a1d-AT-mail.gmail-DOT-COM> Message-Id: <200708071057119.SM05632-AT-CS01S>

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Content-Type: text/plain;

charset="us-ascii"

Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Yes, we take pictures at Bay Village Middle School.

Thank you.

Customer Service

OSP

[edit] Email 2 from Ohio School Pictures

  • Email (with original headers) confirming that Ohio School Pictures is the photographer for Amy’s school. Email addresses have been edited to replace for the “@” with “–AT-“, and “-DOT-COM” with, “-DOT-COM”, so as to limit the spam-damage towards my gmail account, as well as to Ohio School Pictures. Headers have been included for reference validity purposes (to prove I didn't make up the conversation).BlueSapphires 18:08, 7 August 2007 (UTC)


Delivered-To: sapphires.blue-AT-gmail-DOT-COM Received: by 10.65.116.11 with SMTP id t11cs584602qbm;

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 08:31:36 -0700 (PDT)

Received: by 10.35.91.1 with SMTP id t1mr11844102pyl.1186500696509;

Tue, 07 Aug 2007 08:31:36 -0700 (PDT)

Return-Path: <customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM> Received: from mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM (mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM [66.94.95.35])

by mx.google-DOT-COM with ESMTP id n44si12747906pyh.2007.08.07.08.31.35;
Tue, 07 Aug 2007 08:31:36 -0700 (PDT)

Received-SPF: pass (google-DOT-COM: best guess record for domain of customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM designates 66.94.95.35 as permitted sender) Received: from CS01S [66.94.95.34] by mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM with ESMTP

(SMTPD-9.21) id A06D0144; Tue, 07 Aug 2007 11:31:57 -0400

From: "Customer Service" <customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM> To: "'Blue Sapphire'" <sapphires.blue-AT-gmail-DOT-COM> Subject: RE: School: Bay Middle School Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2007 11:31:35 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative;

boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0025_01C7D8E6.83308020"

X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3138 Thread-Index: AcfZBtUBZwXgAYKeSfCyyPoHNmGgFwAAGf6g In-Reply-To: <b4b3d680708070822w6177dc98jfce31b5d6cd52bdd-AT-mail.gmail-DOT-COM> Message-Id: <200708071131510.SM04660-AT-CS01S>

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Yes, we did. Since we are in an office building, do close to 600 schools, and we went digital a couple of years ago, we are sorry but we do not have any records past the last two years.


Thank you.


Customer Service

 _____

From: Blue Sapphire [1] Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2007 11:23 AM To: Customer Service Subject: Re: School: Bay Middle School


Please, did you take pictures at that school in 1989?


Thank you.


Ms. Sapph

[edit] Nice work

The Barnstar of Diligence
For your excellent research at Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2007 August 3#Image:Amyphoto.jpg I hereby award you this barnstar. howcheng {chat} 19:36, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Wow. Just.... wow. Very nice research. Especially good is using the JonBenet case as an example of how these can play out. - TexasAndroid 19:40, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Yes, definitely awesome work. I wish more people took the time to do their homework this way. Videmus Omnia Talk 19:50, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
I'm impressed too. ElinorD (talk) 21:01, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
Gosh, thanks so much for the nice praise. I hope this was helpful.  :) BlueSapphires 21:40, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Peace?

I offer this dove and olive branch to an obviously serious editor, along with an apology for any offense caused. Happy editing! Videmus Omnia Talk 20:49, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
I offer this dove and olive branch to an obviously serious editor, along with an apology for any offense caused. Happy editing! Videmus Omnia Talk 20:49, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
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[edit] Email Release from Ohio School Pictures to use photo of Amy Miheljevic in the Wikipedia Article (implied Fair Use Release)

Name actually spelled Mihaljevic, please see below link

[edit] Email Release from Ohio School Pictures to use photo of Amy Mihaljevic in the Wikipedia Article (implied Fair Use Release)

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To Whom it May Concern:

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It is with great pleasure that I send thanks to Ohio School Pictures, copyright holder of the 1989 school photograph of Amy Mihaljevic, for their gracious gift of a formal release sent to me today. Ohio School Pictures has provided that Wikipedia should have permission to publish the 1989 school photograph of Amy Mihaljevic in the Wikipedia article concerning her disappearance and murder. I'm sure that I represent everyone's opinion when we express our greatest appreciation to Ohio School Pictures for their kind support and generosity in this gesture. We'll take good care of her picture and hopefully this will serve the greater public good.

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Sincere regards,

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BlueSapphires BlueSapphires 22:54, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Copy of the Release to Wikipedia from Ohio School Pictures

August 7, 2007

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Ms. Sapph, Editor

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Wikipedia

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Please consider this a release to use a picture of Amy Mihaljevic that was taken in 1989 for use in an article describing her disappearance and murder.

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If there are any questions, please contact us at one of the numbers listed.

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Thank you.

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Customer Service

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Ohio School Pictures

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FOUR-FOUR-ZERO-TWO-THREE-FOUR-ONE-THREE-THREE-SEVEN

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ONE-EIGHT-ZERO-ZERO-THREE-SIX-FIVE-TWO-FIVE-TWO-FIVE

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Customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM

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[edit] Raw Email for Verification/Validity of Email from Ohio School Pictures to BlueSapphires

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Please note that I've edited the email to replace -AT- and -DOT-COM so that Ohio School Pictures and my gmail account won't be spammed as a result of this being published. I've also edited all phone numbers into literal form for the same reason. Headers for the email are included so as to verify validity of receipt of this email. Thanks,BlueSapphires 22:54, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
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Delivered-To: sapphires.blue-AT-gmail-DOT-COM Received: by 10.65.116.11 with SMTP id t11cs767qbm;

Tue, 7 Aug 2007 14:21:12 -0700 (PDT)

Received: by 10.35.51.19 with SMTP id d19mr12265712pyk.1186521671918;

Tue, 07 Aug 2007 14:21:11 -0700 (PDT)

Return-Path: <customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM> Received: from mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM (mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM [66.94.95.35])

by mx.google-DOT-COM with ESMTP id y45si9565472pyg.2007.08.07.14.21.10;
Tue, 07 Aug 2007 14:21:11 -0700 (PDT)

Received-SPF: pass (google-DOT-COM: best guess record for domain of customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM designates 66.94.95.35 as permitted sender) Received: from CS01S [66.94.95.34] by mail.ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM with ESMTP

(SMTPD-9.21) id A25C0200; Tue, 07 Aug 2007 17
21:32 -0400

From: "Customer Service" <customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM> To: "'Blue Sapphire'" <sapphires.blue-AT-gmail-DOT-COM> Subject: release Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2007 17:21:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative;

boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0006_01C7D917.598FCCE0"

X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcfZOOAgcEKpm/E7TymbukV50ry9Ww== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3138 Message-Id: <20070807172110.SM04660-AT-CS01S>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

=_NextPart_000_0006_01C7D917.598FCCE0

Content-Type: text/plain;

charset="us-ascii"

Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

August 7, 2007






Ms. Sapph, Editor

Wikipedia



Please consider this a release to use a picture of Amy Mihaljevic that was taken in 1989 for use in an article describing her disappearance and murder.


If there are any questions, please contact us at one of the numbers listed.


Thank you.


Customer Service

Ohio School Pictures

FOUR-FOUR-ZERO-TWO-THREE-FOUR-ONE-THREE-THREE-SEVEN

ONE-EIGHT-ZERO-ZERO-THREE-SIX-FIVE-TWO-FIVE-TWO-FIVE

Customerservice-AT-ohioschoolpictures-DOT-COM

[edit] Permission granted by copyright holder for Amy Mihaljevic picture - Please to reload?

The deletion review needs to end and the closing admin will restore the image if that is their decision based on the discussion. -Regards Nv8200p talk 01:44, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Image restored. However, please add something about the permission to the image page, or it might get deleted again for having improper license info. --Coredesat 06:34, 8 August 2007 (UTC)


  • It still might get deleted. Please see the bottom of Image talk:Amyphoto.jpg. This image is not free, and as such must be used under terms of fair use, regardless of any release to Wikipedia. We do not accept "permission only" images on Wikipedia. I've tagged the image as being used under terms of fair use, and tagged it as missing a fair use rationale. Please see the image description page, and see WP:FURG. Thank you, --Durin 13:40, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Image problem

  • There's no time limit for work to be done today. With the missing rationale, there's seven days to work on it. There's no immediate rush. Please see the talk page (bottom) for more information on the current problems. I really truly do appreciate you getting permissions for Wikipedia. It's great seeing a user take initiative like this. The problem is that "permission for Wikipedia" is utterly useless for us. We only accept media as either free or not free. There's no in between "permission to use" case. If there's anything I can do to help, let me know. All the best, --Durin 19:42, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm making the fair use tag and you can help by not making tags that say "delete without fair use" tag. Other help would include doing a "chat" with Videmus Omnia. Occupy him. BlueSapphires 19:48, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

  • Nobody is attempting to anger you or interfere with your editing. You're obviously busy today. That's ok. It really is. You don't have to write the rationale this second, or even this day. Please, relax; we're all in this together. We're just trying to do it right. I'm happy to help if I can. --Durin 19:51, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
I second everything that Durin is saying. I really appreciate the trouble that you've gone to. And there is no hurry. We can discuss the rationale, sourcing, etc., for seven days. In fact, if I were deleting images that had been in a category for deletion for seven days and I knew that people were still working on a problem in good faith, with a reasonable chance of solving it, I wouldn't delete the image. I hope we'll be able to keep it, and absolutely agree that GFDL licences for murdered little girls, allowing anyone to make derivatives works for any purpose, are not appropriate, and that contacting the family would be insensitive. I agree with Durin that the "permission only" is not a licence we accept on Wikipedia, but the work you've done in tracking down the source has been very useful in getting the image properly tagged (we did need a source), and the permission you've obtained at least means that there won't be any complaints. Best wishes. ElinorD (talk) 21:45, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
I really apologize if I came off as pejorative, **esp** to VO (who I blamed for Durin's reversion), but I'm truly too busy to be doing this - and want to help, but frankly, if I dont do this now, I wont do it EVER. I am swamped with responsibilities, and I've spent too too much time that I didnt have already - so this goes now - or I'll not attend to it before it is deleted for lack of fair use criteria template. That's the way my life is right now. It isn't you, it's me. Please tolerate my need to get this done, and if I can help later, I'm happy to. Cheers, BS BlueSapphires 21:52, 8 August 2007 (UTC)