Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Double (Mariners)
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- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was Delete. Nishkid64 (talk) 21:53, 2 May 2007 (UTC)
[edit] The Double (Mariners)
Seattle Mariners sports trivia. A whole lot of asserted notability is burdened on a single play, but no evidence to back it up. What's next, "The Bunt (Sacramento River Cats)"? ~ trialsanderrors 01:00, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Delete. Based on the references provided, neither of the sources even refer to it by this title (the two footnotes which use the citations seem like afterthoughts that have little to nothing to do with said play). From a cursory search, I find nothing that does. Unless it can be properly sourced such that notable media have referred to it as such, this is not encyclopedic. The Catch it ain't. --Kinu t/c 01:11, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Delete - As with the recently deleted "Immaculate Rejection" article, this is a neologism without the sourcing to demonstrate that it has gained any traction as a sports or slang term. Individual plays within a game or sport are almost never notable and this is no exception. Otto4711 01:34, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
Keep As the article stands now, it is not fit for Wikipedia. However, if you give me a month, the I think I can transform this article such that it is fit for Wikipedia. For instance, I've already found one article in a major newspaper referring to the play as "The Double" (it took about 15 seconds to find that article). If I am unable to bring the article up to standards, then I will bring it up for AfD again myself. Pablothegreat85 02:56, 27 April 2007 (UTC)Changed my vote to delete. See below. Pablo Talk | Contributions 21:53, 28 April 2007 (UTC)- Comment: The AfD runs for five days; that should be sufficient time for multiple editors to come up with multiple nontrivial sources. As for the newspaper link, it's definitely better than nothing, but at the same time, it seems somewhat trivial. The title "The Double" in the story might just be creative headlining, seeing as how the story doesn't refer to it as "The Double" (in so many words) once; it would be akin to claiming that (from the same story) "The quiet man" is one of Martinez's nicknames. It's a start though... --Kinu t/c 03:01, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Reply I don't have time right now to re-write the article (I'm working on my thesis), so that's why I need a little extra time. More reliable sources referring to it as "The Double" are here, here, here, and here. Pablothegreat85 03:25, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Reluctantly, I have to change my vote to delete (I am a Mariners fan). I really can't find any sources about the term (as opposed to using the term). Pablothegreat85 03:46, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Reply I don't have time right now to re-write the article (I'm working on my thesis), so that's why I need a little extra time. More reliable sources referring to it as "The Double" are here, here, here, and here. Pablothegreat85 03:25, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Comment - note that per WP:NEO "To support the use of (or an article about) a particular term we must cite reliable secondary sources such as books and papers about the term — not books and papers that use the term." Otto4711 03:41, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Comment: The AfD runs for five days; that should be sufficient time for multiple editors to come up with multiple nontrivial sources. As for the newspaper link, it's definitely better than nothing, but at the same time, it seems somewhat trivial. The title "The Double" in the story might just be creative headlining, seeing as how the story doesn't refer to it as "The Double" (in so many words) once; it would be akin to claiming that (from the same story) "The quiet man" is one of Martinez's nicknames. It's a start though... --Kinu t/c 03:01, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Delete. This isn't exactly a Shot heard 'round the world. It is already mentioned in the Mariners' article under their history, which is abundantly sufficient. Arkyan • (talk) 15:02, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Delete: Fails WP:V, WP:NN. Every team that just barely makes the playoffs in every sport does so because of some play or another. I'm awaiting some serious sorting for the assertions that this one double saved professional baseball in Seattle or that most Mariners' fans recall it vividly to this day, and I admit I'm hugely skeptical. RGTraynor 16:03, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Comment This play occurred after the Mariners had already made the playoffs. As a Mariners fan, I can say that in did save pro baseball in Seattle and most Mariners fans recall it vividly. I don't think that's the problem with this article. The problem is that the article asserts that the play is called "The Double" in the article, but there are too few reliable sources referring to it as "The Double." Pablo 16:52, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- Generally, our inclusion criterion for individual sports moments is that they make a couple of "key moments in baseball history" lists. If the event is only relevant to the Mariners franchise it's sufficient to cover it in the Mariners article (as it is now). Only if it transcendents franchise history it makes sense to single it out in an individual article. ~ trialsanderrors 02:54, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
- Reply I'm not arguing that it should have its own article. Pablo 02:59, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
- Generally, our inclusion criterion for individual sports moments is that they make a couple of "key moments in baseball history" lists. If the event is only relevant to the Mariners franchise it's sufficient to cover it in the Mariners article (as it is now). Only if it transcendents franchise history it makes sense to single it out in an individual article. ~ trialsanderrors 02:54, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
- Comment This play occurred after the Mariners had already made the playoffs. As a Mariners fan, I can say that in did save pro baseball in Seattle and most Mariners fans recall it vividly. I don't think that's the problem with this article. The problem is that the article asserts that the play is called "The Double" in the article, but there are too few reliable sources referring to it as "The Double." Pablo 16:52, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
