Talk:Apostle

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I thought Apostle was a general name for someone who was choosen by a god, to represent the god in all forms. I do not think it applies only to the Christian Mythos. --Thapthim

Removed from the article:

Some people feel Paul was the apostle chosen by God to replace him.

If you're going to make that claim, then go into a little more detail about why.

I think the way the attitude of the apostles towards Jews link is done is really misleading and dishonest (I don't necessarily disgree with the sentiment, BTW). Whoever put it in should think of a more ethical way of doing it and should be ashamed of himself (or herself). JHK

I didn't put it in, but I've tried to rephrase it to be less misleading. I personally consider the charge to be ridiculous when you consider that all the Apostles were Jews, as well as most of the initial converts to Christianity. Right or wrong, they thought that Christianity was the fulfillment of Jewish belief and prophecies, and didn't think they were replacing Judaism with a completely foreign religion. --Wesley
Thanks!

According to the article:

"Judas Iscariot was one of the twelve disciples, but was never an apostle."

According to the Bible (Matthew 10:2-4):

"Now the names of the twelve apostles are these: The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; and James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother; Philip and Bartholomew; Thomas and Matthew the tax collector; James the son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus; Simon the Zealot, and Judas Iscariot, the one who betrayed Him."

Slight discrepency? Bagpuss 19:26 Apr 24, 2003 (UTC)

You're quite correct. I think at the time I was thinking that they weren't called apostles until after Christ's resurrection, and before that they were disciples, but clearly I was wrong. The Seventy he sent out during his earthly ministry are probably also called apostles. Thanks for the catch. Wesley 02:56 Apr 26, 2003 (UTC)


Proposal: Make "Mormon Apostles" its own entry, with a link from here. At some point, it deserves its own entry, and including all the material about Mormon apostles here would make the entry a mess. COGDEN Nov 10, 2003.

Sounds fine to me. Wesley 16:52, 10 Nov 2003 (UTC)
That article should be titled Apostle (Mormonism). —B 21:23, Nov 10, 2003 (UTC)
Done. Moved material to Apostle (Mormonism). COGDEN

Any mention that the apostles might have been between 7 to 13 depending on the books ? PomPom

[edit] "Other apostles" and POV

I like Paul Tillich. I absolutely love C.S. Lewis. However, calling the former the "apostle to the intellectuals" and the latter "apostle to sceptics" is highly POV in a post-reformation age. Tillich is a Protestant who writes solely from that POV, so putting him up on the level of apostle is a bias. Lewis, too, is a Protestant. I think he wirtes to intellectuals fully as much as Tillich does, but he does so with a humane touch. For "apostle to the intellectuals," Thomas Merton and Søren Kierkegaard could also qualify. For apostle to skeptics, the list is enormous. Virtually all Christian writers attempt apologetics at some point, and I don't see Lewis as much of a converter. He assumes a Christian readership far more than a non-believing one. At any rate, I have removed the following from the article for these reasons:

Further "Apostles" would include:

Geogre 14:10, 16 Sep 2004 (UTC)


Comments: The original ~12 [the gospel's names don't match and name more than 12] Apostles are probably Jewish ethnicity, although Andrew (Andreas), Philip (Philippos), Bartholomew (Bartholomaios), Thaddeus (Theodotus) are Greek names. Also, although James the brother of Jesus is never named an Apostle, he clearly is the leader of the Jerusalem Church (later called first bishop of Jerusalem), presumably because he is the brother of Jesus (those who believe in the perpetual virginity of Mary don't believe he is the son of Mary). And the church contains Aramaic speaking members [Ac1.19] and Greek speaking members [Ac6.1] and 7 Greeks are added to the 12 Apostles: Stephen, Philip, Prochorus, Nicanor, Timon, Parmenas and Nicolaus.

One more comment regarding apostle/disciple. Disciple is the translation of the Greek mathetes or student. Apostle is the translation of the Greek apostolos or emissary. Thus Paul can claim to be an apostle (an emissary on a mission), but he is not part of the group of "12 Apostles" selected by Jesus or approved by the Jerusalem Church. Likewise Paul calls some people apostles/emissaries, but they may not be part of the "12 Apostles" of the Jerusalem Church.

One more comment: you say apostolos=messenger, it could, but in general apostolos=emissary is a better translation, messenger=angelos which is the word commonly translated as angel. A messenger carries a message (word), an emissary is on a mission (action), but at times the distinction is blurred. Ref: Greek-English Lexicon of the NT, Bauer-Arndt-Gingrich-Danker, Univ. of Chicago Press


About the "70" only mentioned in Luke 10:1-10

What English translation translates the Greek as apostle here? The Greek has the *verb* apostello which means to send away. Ref: Greek-English Lexicon of NT, Bauer et al

I removed the sentence "In Acts 6.1, seven Greeks are appointed by the 12 Apostles: Stephen, Philip, Prochorus, Nicanor, Timon, Parmenas and Nicolaus." These Greeks were called deacons, not apostles, and the sentence really had nothing to do with the rest of the paragraph.


Mkehrt

[edit] Muhammad as God's Apostle in Islam

Muslims often call Muhammad the "Apostle of God." Should this be added along with the other uses of "apostle"? --Kitabparast 17:07, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

I have edited this entry (which I definitely agree should be on this page) to try to make it more clear. I have changed the link to "Rasul" because that is the actual word which is often translated "apostle" and that article explains its application to Muhammmed. SlackerMom 13:18, 23 August 2007 (UTC)